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DC's population demands a higher attendance. That's the heart of it.Originally Posted by ajc54terp
They have a real reason to be excited, and with that it should be reflected NOW in a city 3 times larger than Baltimore.
If we woke up this off-season and Baltimore had tripled in size... I'm completely confident the O's attendance would reflect that.
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I'll be happy if we average over 30000
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Could happen. I would not be shocked. There certainly is good reason to expect that figure at a minimum.
But until it does, these "will DC get behind baseball" questions are legit.
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Probably ~half of the DC metro area's population is in suburban MD. PG and Montgomery counties are damn near 2 mill of them.
Were all of those Marylanders, many (most) of whom being longtime O's fans, supposed to drop the O's in favor of the Nats the minute the Expos moved into town simply because they're in the DC metro area ? Would that be a switch you would advocate ?
Some have, others haven't. I read recently (don't have a link, will have to trust my memory) that 65% of Nats attendance comes from VA. 25% from MD. 10% from DC.
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in a nutshell...yes. ....Abso-effing-lutely.
A few people might not want to read their local papers, local TV that support the local team...but that's a few. (there are Redskins fans in Baltimore still I'm sure)
Having a town Identity attached to a team is the most common draw in sports for crying out loud Kudzu...stop making excuses...you've been saying this now for YEARS. Do you need a generation of people to actually die before one can address the woes of DC baseball attendance?
I'm sure a ton of people In Charlotte root for the Braves... think they would have problems filling a stadium based on "rooting for the Braves"? It would be about whether or not Charlotte was a town that rooted for Baseball... not the Braves vs. the new team
Last edited by hampden623; 04-17-2012 at 03:30 PM.
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Why ? They're Marylanders. Who have likely been rooting for the O's since birth. And like crabcakes and skanky women from Dundalk and Essex.
You're teling me that a 65 year old lifetime Laurel resident, who fell in love with baseball and the O's when he went to his first game when he was 7 years old, has a bunch of Brooks, Cakes, Boog, Eddie and Cal memorabilia, and had season tix to the O's for 40 years should have dumped the O's like a bad habit in 2005 just because the census data says he lives in the DC metro area ?
Your Charlotte Braves fans example is a bad one. Because Atlanta is 250 miles away, as opposed to 45 miles.
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Why ? They're Marylanders. Who have likely been rooting for the O's since birth. And like crabcakes and skanky women from Dundalk and Essex.
You're teling me that a 65 year old lifetime Laurel resident, who fell in love with baseball and the O's when he went to his first game when he was 7 years old, has a bunch of Brooks, Cakes, Boog, Eddie and Cal memorabilia, and had season tix to the O's for 40 years should have dumped the O's like a bad habit in 2005 just because the census data says he lives in the DC metro area ?
Your Charlotte Braves fans example is a bad one. Because Atlanta is 250 miles away, as opposed to 45 miles.
YES, these people exist....But these people you mention ARE NOT THE ISSUE for failed attendance in DC.
...Reston. ...Alexandria. ...Fairfax...THIS is the hotbed of growth that led to DC being able to have the money and upward middle class clout to support baseball. ...Allegedly.
A family in Reston isn't a crab cake eating bunch of Natty Boh drinkers that "Loves Dem O's Hon". And the west side of DC around Reston is where the support SHOULD be coming from...it is not.
They almost built the stadium there to accommodate this specifically targeted group because of population density for crying out loud.
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Did you see the statistics I posted regarding where the Nats attendance comes from ? ~Half of the DC metro area is in MD. Yet only ~25% of Nats attendance comes from MD.
The VA suburbs are doing their part. The MD suburbs aren't. According to you, they should be.
So... what needs to be done ?
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I'm sure the Nats marketing team understands Laurel. I'm sure they understand the difference between MD and VA, and how to alot resources to get the share of this multi-million dollar pie.
To say that "VA is doing their share" I disagree. I'm not even sure what you are basing this on. The VA side of DC is bigger than Baltimore alone...everything else is a bonus in MD. This is a major market that 3 times larger than Baltimore.
We could go round and round (we do). What needs to be done? Did you see my earlier post about the Wash. Post? That is a big one IMO. DC's sense of "community" compared to Baltimore is a factor. If DC had a better sense of community... this whole loyalty thing you mention would disapate rather quickly. But DC does not have the unified community thing Baltimore (and most cities that support baseball) does...
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Do you understand that suburban MD is ~half of the population of the DC metro area yet accounts for ~25% of the Nats attendance ?
Um, hello...McFly...
The MD and VA suburbs are ~the same size. I'll post actual stats if you wish. PG and Monkey counties alone account for ~1.8 mill people. That's not including Charles, Calvert, Frederick, etc...
What needs to be done is that you address my point that while the MD suburbs of DC (which you gleefully point out arehe DC metro area) support the Nats at a rate that's less than half of their suburban VA counterparts.
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Can I see a link on this other than you just throwing it out there as fact?
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Yes. Assuming that you'd think I'd knowingly provide a falsehood here that I couldn't back up.
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No, I'm not saying you would... I'd just like to see a full article on the topic if it's out there.
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If you insist:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports...S_story_4.html
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Thanks Kudzu... Good article.
a 60-40 split on attendance is what we are talking about across the Potomac? Not sure why this effects overall attendance being poor?
You are saying what split exactly increases attendance overall?
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I had the VA attendance 5% too high and the DC attendance 5% too low. Doesn't affect my point one bit though.
Suburban VA in the DC metro area is supporting the Nats very well. More than double those from Suburban MD who are coming to the games.
DC metro area suburban MD is ~= in population to suburban DC metro area DC.
If suburban MD in the DC metro area came to the games at the same rate as suburban VA did, the Nats attendance would be ~35% higher than it has been.
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It's percentages... you are not going to get 60% from VA and 60% from MD.
Suburban VA is NOT supporting the Nat's well. 60% of not many people to start with... is not many people. The Nat's are UNDERachieving in attendance... period. Your article states that in many places based on the fact DC the 8th largest city in the country.
They are not "doing well" in certain areas based on percentages instead of real numbers.
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You're missing the point, hamp. Of course you can't get 60% from both VA and MD. But you could get the same number of fans from VA and MD, right ?
Well, that ain't happening.
The Nats have have averaged ~26,000 per game since moving to DC. If you look at the 60/25/15% breakdown, that's:
VA - 15,600
MD - 6,500
DC - 3,900
If the MD suburbs were supporting the Nats the same as their VA counterparts (15,600 per game) then they'd be averaging 35,100 in attendance per game, which would be 2.8 mill a year.
But they ain't doing it. You think they should, but that just isn't happening.
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it's not that transient city any longer. I know countless 30-40+ year old people who were born and raised in the DC metro area. everyone likes to use that excuse, but it doesn't float. if it was such a transient city, they wouldn't have kept thier foortball, basketball and hockey team. all those teams would have left town by now.
there is only one reason the Nats don't draw. DC will only support a winner. until that team is deep in the hunt, or actually in the playoffs, I don't see DC coming out. even the most staunch supporters of DC deserving its own team have said this.
there are more than enough people to fill that ballpark. and the team has been here long enough for some sort of fan connection to take hold.
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I don't think its realistic in any way shape or form to expect the MD suburbs to compete with the VA suburbs for the Nats affections attendance-wise.
The VA suburbs are is the largest, most populated area by far. That IS where the majority of fans have to come from. They alone will dictate how the Nats attendance will go, they almost will solely dictate this.
Do the Nats want MD fans? obviously. Just Like the O's want those Bethesday fans? Obviously. But both franchise understand this is their fringe, not their bread and butter. You assuming the MD suburbs is part of the Nats attendance woes is way off base.
Northern VA is the Nats bread and butter... and it is not acting that way.
They should have built the stadium in Reston, and I will almost bet if the Lerners and their marketing team had a chance to replace the stadium it would be in Reston VA.
here's how the region should be acting...as a default.
VA - 24,600
MD - 8,500
DC - 3,900
Winning, exciting team? bump the numbers up across the board from all areas for the 5-8k more bandwagon newcomers.
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