Baltimore Co. on the hook for $4.5 M in RG Steel bankruptcy

[buzzthefuzz]

http://www.bizjournals.com/baltimore...t.html?s=print

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/opi...,2621562.story

My response:

Is this good planning on the executive's part or, does he have the cart before the horse as written in that same Sun editorial:

in my opinion, the one issue left out of the equation is planning. How so, you may ask? Consider the following quote from a June 4 Baltimore Sun editorial about Baltimore County Executive Kevin Kamenetz’s decision to create the Sparrows Point Partnership, a task force to study the growth potential of the Post of Baltimore:

It all boils to to leadership, leadership! They don't mind spending our money even when the odds are against them.

My question is why didn't the soothsayers do their due diligence when many of workers at the plant knew how this sad and unfortunate story would end?

[Mitchum]

The County can't make them prepay their property taxes even if they know things are heading South.

The County or the County Executive didn't do anything wrong here,

[buzzthefuzz]

The County can't make them prepay their property taxes even if they know things are heading South.

The County or the County Executive didn't do anything wrong here,

Then what happened to the $4.5 million? If what you say is true how is their tax calculated. I'm sure there were some tax credits in that loop somewhere, even minus the tax breaks on payment.

[Mitchum]

They never received it but it is due them. They will wait in line along with the other creditors I guess.

[buzzthefuzz]

I don't understand why they went down that road to begin with. RG did not have a good rep as a solid company, the business climate was bad along with the economy.

The competition overseas was tough and the infrastructure was old. Add it up and you've got a no win situation.

[Mitchum]

I'm not buying it. It all started with Wilbur Smith. He raped and pillaged the place. Then the Indians owned it and they managed to make it work but the Feds stepped in and said they had to divest, so they sold it to the Russians who milked it for everything who tossed it off to Ira Rennert. RENCO is a solid company.

I am not buying the idea that foreign competition is to blame either. There are plenty of American Steel plants making money AK, Steel Dynamics, Nucor, the Sevestal Plant down in Mississippi........

[buzzthefuzz]

Even they have to compete. To the winner goes the spoils. RG was old, poorly run, and out gunned by both here and overseas competition. That's why I said another shot was a bad idea.

[Woodbuchr]

Even they have to compete. To the winner goes the spoils. RG was old, poorly run, and out gunned by both here and overseas competition. That's why I said another shot was a bad idea.

The only part of that whole statement I agree with is that RG Sparrows Point was poorly run.

The Sparrows Point plant is not "outgunned". Contrary to what The Spew (I'm sorry- The Brew) says, The Sparrows Point Hot Strip mill is not 1947 vintage, the furnaces were totally replaced in the early 90's with new Walking Beam furnaces and a Reversing Rougher was added.

The L-Furnace is still one of the best in the country if run properly (which it hasn't been since Severstal tried to run it on garbage material- Garbage in garbage out) and one of the Continous Casters was widened in the late 90's or early 2000's (and it was built in the 80's)

RG did not have long term contracts for ore and coke which meant buying on the spot market at higher prices. Spare parts were constantly not available which caused problems in maintenance (and for those who do not know steelmaking is very hard on equipment).

Not to mention the foreign competition, as I have mentioned before, doesn't have to pay their workers a livable wage, worry about environmental issues, and can dump their artificially underpriced products here under the guise of "Free Trade" while we have to meet standards they don't.

The "winner" in this case was in a rigged competition. Another shot with a company that knows what it is doing (a steel company not junk bond investor types) may just be the answer.

You were a cop, right Buzz? How about if the county brought in mercenaries that were paid less than you with less benefits and less controls and made them cops and put other regular cops on the street? Would it still be to the winner belongs the spoils?

[buzzthefuzz]

The only part of that whole statement I agree with is that RG Sparrows Point was poorly run.

You were a cop, right Buzz? How about if the county brought in mercenaries that were paid less than you with less benefits and less controls and made them cops and put other regular cops on the street? Would it still be to the winner belongs the spoils?

Woodbuchr, everything you wrote was true. My winner comment was meant to point out the economic reality of the global market.

The same is happening in police work. We now have cadets, PSO's, and many other positions filled by contract workers or civilians.

You are right this country has turned it's back on the American workers. But to that I say you get what you vote for and the consumers can't have it both ways and you know that. The problem is the entitlements. Those who have no stake in he game, want all the goodies without any of tides that bind them.

[Mitchum]

Your right. Vote for the likes of a vulture capitalist like Romney or his best buddy Ira Rennert and the American worker is guaranteed to get screwed.


LOL The "tides" that bind them.

[buzzthefuzz]

I don't look at party lines. It's about the issues. A Democratic could be a blue dog, a moderate or a liberal. Same with a Republican.

Look at the data. High unemployment and this little ditty in today's Sun.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/bre...0,422089.story

And this:

You got, no light at the end of the tunnel.

[bmore_ken]

Still campaigning huh Buzz?

[Mitchum]

I don't look at party lines. It's about the issues. A Democratic could be a blue dog, a moderate or a liberal. Same with a Republican.

Look at the data. High unemployment and this little ditty in today's Sun.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/bre...0,422089.story

And this:

You got, no light at the end of the tunnel.

You are almost gleeful that people are losing their jobs.

[buzzthefuzz]

You are almost gleeful that people are losing their jobs.

I basically died in the line of duty and was kicked to the ground. Workis the lifeblood of the human spirit.

The jobs were lost over big business making poor decisions and politicians pandering to stay in power.

O'Malley is kicking the can down the road on the states pension mess.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000..._WSJ_US_News_5

[Mitchum]

Politicians had nothing to do with the jobs being lost.

The Governor has nothing to do with RG Steel's Pension or any of the other companies that operated at SP. After Wilbur Smith raped the old BethSteel pension it was turned over to the Feds and the PBGC.


........and your link is about San Jose, California, not Maryland nor the Governor.

[buzzthefuzz]

Then why has Wisconsin drastically reduced their deficit lowered the unemployment rate?

Who puts in the bills for the government pensions? Who votes on them?

[Mitchum]

Whaaaat??

Wisconsin has nothing to do with RG Steel. and RG Steel isn't represented by Pubic Service Unions.

[octoburn]

Still campaigning huh Buzz?

Exactly.

It's difficult to understand how someone can complain about using "positions filled by contract workers or civilians" ~ presumably without the pension benefits that police officers receive ~ while at the same time complaining about entitlements and confusing public service pensions with those that are not.

For all of the current~governor's many faults, this situation is not one of them unless losing an election and a government job causes some to see a connection where none exists.

[buzzthefuzz]

Exactly.

It's difficult to understand how someone can complain about using "positions filled by contract workers or civilians" ~ presumably without the pension benefits that police officers receive ~ while at the same time complaining about entitlements and confusing public service pensions with those that are not.

For all of the current~governor's many faults, this situation is not one of them unless losing an election and a government job causes some to see a connection where none exists.

You have to follow the course of this conversation and the context of my remarks.

I have no interest in running for office. Once was enough. The government is not the Holly-Grail.

For all of the current~governor's many faults,

I took that out of context and the point of your remark. You are doing the same.

[octoburn]

You have to follow the course of this conversation and the context of my remarks.

I have no interest in running for office. Once was enough. The government is not the Holly-Grail.

I took that out of context and the point of your remark. You are doing the same.

I disagree.

You are trying to establish causal relationships where none exist.

And then complaining about it.

Again.