"But are telling the Cubs and the rest of civilization that Bundy and Machado are not available" So let's end that nonsense talk on here once and for all. O's aren't stupid enough to trade either guy
Member
Stark: O's in thick of Garza sweepstakes
"But are telling the Cubs and the rest of civilization that Bundy and Machado are not available" So let's end that nonsense talk on here once and for all. O's aren't stupid enough to trade either guy
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If they trade either one of them I think the Oriole faithful would collectively revolt.
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What else do we have that anyone else wants?
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Offer Matusz, Flaherty, Reynolds and Nick Johnson for Garza and Soriano and the Cubs will jump at it. We can then move Davis to 1B and sign Hall of Famer Vlad to DH.Originally Posted by bmore_ken
Member
why does a team that you considered and constantly remind us is going to win 95 games need to make any trades. Every team in the AL East, according to you has regressed and/or collapsed...according to you winning the east is going to be easy...you would think someone with your genius and acumen would be dead set against any trade for or signing of over-the-hill, no longer productive players...
the Cubs are trying to jettison over-paid and under-performing players, they don't need the same in return...the trade you proposed (unless they rehired mcphail) is not even worth considering....
Member
I never said winning the AL East was going to be easy - I said the O's would win 95 games and make the playoffs. You said the O's would win 65 games. How's that looking?
My trade benefits both the O's and the Cubs. For the O's, Garza and Soriano are upgrades over the current alternatives on the team and would help the push to 95. The O's also benefit by getting rid of Reynolds now rather than at the end of the year and further benefit by eliminating relatively useless players like Flaherty and Johnson. The Cubs are dumping salary and will be able to do the same with Reynolds, Flaherty and Johnson at year end. In Matusz, they're gaining a young pitcher that the Cubs might believe can turn it around facing weak NL lineups.
Member
why does a team you predicted to win 95 games need upgrades?? 95 win teams are very solid from 1-25....you are advocating to get rid of one everyday player and starter who were going to lead this team to 95 wins...sounds like you don't want to own that prediction....and FWIW, even troll moon v1.0 predicted 94 but you agreed with they'd win the east (go back and read the prediction thread) you also predicted the collapse of the sox and yankees were slipping....the yankees certainly playing like they are slipping....they are on a pace to win 98 which certainly less than the 97 they won last year.....they certainly look on the way down....
good call.....especially on the continued bleating to sign a superstar who led the team to a last place finish last year....
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You must think the Cubs FO is on drugs if you think they'll take that deal
Member
Not much else to offer. Word is the Cubs want 2 prime young players which is why Soriano keeps getting throw into any proposed O's trade. Take some of his contract and maybe a package of Schoop,Tillman and Hoes or Avery gets it done. Cubs rumor website predicts Dempster to LA, Garza to Atl and Soriano to Cleveland.
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The O's have value.
Does anyone serious think that two 25 year old former top prospect (still developing) pitchers don't have value? What about a potential future closer?
Avery also has value, as do several other guys.
There are other teams out there with more B+ "prospects", but are they in?
The O's have enough depth and flexibility to get a deal done, it's just a matter of how far they are willing to go, and how creative they are willing to get.
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it's not a question of do they have value...it's a question of whether they have enough value....there is a big difference, one that is determined by the team wanting to acquire "prospects"...the wOes have historically over-valued and over-estimated the value of their 40 man roster....
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1. Every team overvalues their players. Stop the trolling.
2. Enough value? You don't think Avery has value? Arrieta? Matusz? Tillman?
Stop the trolling.
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calling me a troll? you are one of those unemployed comedians I keep reading about....
try evelynn wood or some other course that will help you with your reading comprehension....nowhere did I say they didn't have value...if you are going to lie about what I said, try to at least be somewhat clever...ok?
again...think hard...enough value is decided by the team you are trying to make a trade with...they get to make that call.....
now go learn how to understand what you read, not what you hoped you read....
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Right...the call isn't made by you. Therefore, your hyperbolic conjecture means as much as mine.
The O's can make a deal and provide value - if that's what the Cubs are looking for - and they can provide a competitive package. There's no reason to say that they can't.
I'm not reading what I want to read, I'm reading what you typed - and as soon as you put in something like "the O's overrate their prospects", that borders on political rhetorical discourse.
I don't know what others think about O's players (except for the Bleacher Report, who rate the O's system 9th in baseball), and I have no idea what Theo is looking for.
Theo and DD will make that decision and work out a deal, or not.
What I am seeing is that DD is a difference maker, and this isn't the same Jurassic FO that we've had to put up with for the past 15 years.
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Where ?
Look at what the Nats gave up to get Gio Gonzales.
Minus Bundy and Machado, do the O's have anything remotely like that ?
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Gio is worth 2 of Garza right now.
He's younger, cost controlled, and better.
Garza is better than 3/5 of the O's staff right now, maybe 4/5, but he's not an ace like Gio.
If Theo gets anything like that for Garza, I will be either a. impressed or b. watching Garza pitch for the Yanks - because they're the only team looking for an arm who would be willing able to come close to that Gio deal.
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No kidding.
Um, yeah...
Gio's not an ace either. Or at least he wasn't in the previous offseason.
If I were a MLB GM, I'd prety much ignore Theo at this point. Is he even old enough to drink ?
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Yeah, he was considered an ace at that point.
Here's one example: http://content.usatoday.com/communit...ez-athletics/1
another: http://washington.nationals.mlb.com/...s_oak&c_id=oak
Beane got ace value in the trade.
Garza is pretty much a 2-3 right now, 29 years old, and only controlled for 1 1/2 years. He'll command a solid return, but not the level that the Cubs would hope to get (unless Theo swindles someone). If he were controlled for 3 years, then he would pull more.
Member
What it comes down to: is any team willing to offer 2 of it's best prospects for Garza? If so the O's can't match. Schoop is a guy you can center a deal around but does any team love Tillman,Avery or Hoes enough to consider them big time prospects? I doubt it. O's are still a year away from having that kind of depth. Adding this year's picks to the system plus having Delmonico and Esposito develop could prop our system into the top 10 this time in 2013
Member
I dont want Garza if it means getting Soriano and giving up legit prospects in return. Schoop, unless I hear his defense is bad, is needed to replace Roberts as soon as next year. Delmonico looks like a keeper in Delmarva. DD had Ed Jackson for the price of a 4 year deal and decided not to sign him. I like Ed Jackson better than Garza by the way.
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