So who's next?

[slapshot]

I heard both UVA and UNC once referred to as boutique, liberal arts, public ivies. Anyway, I have childhood friends who have degrees from those two schools. Complete a-holes.

Yes, UVa has the feel of a boutique liberal art college...and they seem to promote that aura. By most state school standards, they are tiny (which helps heir selectivity score on US News college rankings). However, their research facilities (for graduate studies) are a real joke. They are pretty much a non-player in many graduate fields of study - especially in the physical sciences and engineering.

John F Kenedy, in a speech on the steps of the Michigan student union, referred to Michigan as the "Harvard of the Midwest". I don't know if I agree, but if you look at graduate school rankings, they are usually in the top 15 of every category. Very comprehensive and competitive university.

[Brohan]

UVA is the Best public University in the country, simpleton.

Who the F cares WHERE the education happens, as long as it's comprehensive ?

I mean, other than you ?

We are talking sports and money here cletus.

If the metric is developing a holes, yes, The University is the best.

[slapshot]

That aside, his statement is false. UVa is not the best.

#1. University of California, Berkeley
#2. University of California, Los Angeles

...UVa, UMich and UNC round out the top 5 pubs.

But the UVa ranking is misleading....with one of the smallest undergraduate enrollments for a flagship public university, of only 14K total undergrad, they benefit immensely by the small size, in a number of ranking criteria. By comparison, Md's undergraduate enrollment as about 26K, or nearly 12,000 more undergraduate students than UVa.

[TonyD79]

it is a little odd the bean counters running the 'super conferences' are running after such a short-sighted goal of cable markets.

You mean internet delivery systems will actually MOVE populations? How does that work?

Big Ten already delivers all their games via the internet.

[Arslan]

So the ACC is suing MD, demanding payment of $50 million. The remaining 11 ACC schools are unified and publicly backing the ACC's lawsuit. Why would FSU, Clemson or GTech support a lawsuit that could potentially affect their finances? Until the lawsuit is settled, which may take years, it appears there won't be any further defections from the ACC, unless there's a one-time, multiple school defection to either SEC or Big 12.

[slapshot]

So the ACC is suing MD, demanding payment of $50 million. The remaining 11 ACC schools are unified and publicly backing the ACC's lawsuit. Why would FSU, Clemson or GTech support a lawsuit that could potentially affect their finances? Until the lawsuit is settled, which may take years, it appears there won't be any further defections from the ACC, unless there's a one-time, multiple school defection to either SEC or Big 12.

DISCLAIMER: THis is just speculation. Not my speculation.

Interesting article in Bleacher Report the other day that speculated that Dulaney's (B1G commish) ultimate strategy/plan is to "encourage" the "destabalization" of the ACC so that he can make a more serious run at getting the "ultimate prize", which is, ND.

The thought process goes something like this:

(1) Add a "strategic" (read TV market) member to the B1G from the ACC.
(2) Md was vulnerable (chosen) because of it's financial situation AND potential TV market.
(3) Rutgers added to round to 14 members, AND, to help increase interest in the BTN in the NYC/NJ markets.
(4) ND's NBC contract runs to 2015, and currently set at $15mil/year, but given current performance by ND, is likely to go to $25 mil the next time (2014) the contract comes up for negotiations.
(5) The "destabalization" of the ACC will encourage some members to "explore" opportunities with the SEC and/ or B12.
(6) Destabalization then sends more ACC members out to other conferences....maybe by the 2014 timeframe?
(7) Once additional ACC schools have announced their defection, Delaney, with the more profitable (expanded) BTN, then approaches ND for one last pitch....to the tune of $30mil/year....or more than what they get from NBC.
(8) Once ND signs, picking the 16 member, from what remains of the ACC is easy. Latest rummor is GT (neither UVa nor UNC).



No idea if any of this is true, or will become reality....BUT, knowing what I know about Dulaney, it would not surprise me that he is still working on ways to bring in the biggest prize of them all, ND. I do believe, however, that the B1G, SEC and B12 will all be 16 member conferences within 2 years. Where those additional members will come from is anybody's guess....but the ACC is a good bet.

As to your question, "Why would FSU, Clemson or GTech support a lawsuit that could potentially affect their finances?" Would you expect them NOT to publically rally around the wagon? I wouldn't. In fact, if I'm the subject of constant rummors/gossip about leaving, the easiest way to deflect and send those rumors in a different direction, is to publically support the lawsuit. When negotiating sensitive deals, the last thing you want are prying eyes and ears. But public support (from it's members) means nothing in a civil lawsuit, such as this. It costs them nothing to support...and ultimately, whether they support, or don't, will have little or no impact oin the outcome of the lawsuit.

[kudzu]

I heard both UVA and UNC once referred to as boutique, liberal arts, public ivies. Anyway, I have childhood friends who have degrees from those two schools. Complete a-holes.

Perhaps you ought to re-evaluate your friends.

A-hole.

[slapshot]

The new reality within 2 years....you know it's coming. The Big East Light (ACC) with be a shell of it's former self, within 2 years.

The good news is, Maryland is out front of the curve.

From an ACC web site:

http://www.accsports.com/blogs/jim-y...inevitable.php

[kudzu]

The new reality within 2 years....you know it's coming. The Big East Light (ACC) with be a shell of it's former self, within 2 years.

The good news is, Maryland is out front of the curve.

From an ACC web site:

http://www.accsports.com/blogs/jim-y...inevitable.php

Or the bottom of the parabola.

[Eastside Terp]

next biggest tv markets for them moving this way would be charlotte and atlanta ........

unc or nc state and georgia tech? ........

nc state is more of a big ten type school with a strong engineering program, etc......

(and yes I know where charlotte is relative to chapel hill, raliegh and durham and have been to all those schools) .....

[kudzu]

next biggest tv markets for them moving this way would be charlotte and atlanta ........

unc or nc state and georgia tech? ........

nc state is more of a big ten type school with a strong engineering program, etc......

(and yes I know where charlotte is relative to chapel hill, raliegh and durham and have been to all those schools) .....

So now academic institutions are for sale to the higest bidder ?

[slapshot]

So now academic institutions are for sale to the higest bidder ?

Flipping that around, most fans have no problem recruiting the one and done athlete - no matter how they do it. All in the name of winning.

I've argued against this practice for the simple reason that the one and done athlete does not represent the school. He doesn't embody any of the interests or love of the university that the rest of the students do. He has no interest in being there any longer than he has to. Yet, when he wins a championship, we fans claim WE are #1. The one and done is nothing more than a hired mercenary. So, if the university is guilty of buying a hired gun to win championships...then there should be no surprises that it's athletic department is also for sale.

[Arslan]

DISCLAIMER: THis is just speculation. Not my speculation.

Interesting article in Bleacher Report the other day that speculated that Dulaney's (B1G commish) ultimate strategy/plan is to "encourage" the "destabalization" of the ACC so that he can make a more serious run at getting the "ultimate prize", which is, ND.

The thought process goes something like this:

(1) Add a "strategic" (read TV market) member to the B1G from the ACC.
(2) Md was vulnerable (chosen) because of it's financial situation AND potential TV market.
(3) Rutgers added to round to 14 members, AND, to help increase interest in the BTN in the NYC/NJ markets.
(4) ND's NBC contract runs to 2015, and currently set at $15mil/year, but given current performance by ND, is likely to go to $25 mil the next time (2014) the contract comes up for negotiations.
(5) The "destabalization" of the ACC will encourage some members to "explore" opportunities with the SEC and/ or B12.
(6) Destabalization then sends more ACC members out to other conferences....maybe by the 2014 timeframe?
(7) Once additional ACC schools have announced their defection, Delaney, with the more profitable (expanded) BTN, then approaches ND for one last pitch....to the tune of $30mil/year....or more than what they get from NBC.
(8) Once ND signs, picking the 16 member, from what remains of the ACC is easy. Latest rummor is GT (neither UVa nor UNC).



No idea if any of this is true, or will become reality....BUT, knowing what I know about Dulaney, it would not surprise me that he is still working on ways to bring in the biggest prize of them all, ND. I do believe, however, that the B1G, SEC and B12 will all be 16 member conferences within 2 years. Where those additional members will come from is anybody's guess....but the ACC is a good bet.

As to your question, "Why would FSU, Clemson or GTech support a lawsuit that could potentially affect their finances?" Would you expect them NOT to publically rally around the wagon? I wouldn't. In fact, if I'm the subject of constant rummors/gossip about leaving, the easiest way to deflect and send those rumors in a different direction, is to publically support the lawsuit. When negotiating sensitive deals, the last thing you want are prying eyes and ears. But public support (from it's members) means nothing in a civil lawsuit, such as this. It costs them nothing to support...and ultimately, whether they support, or don't, will have little or no impact oin the outcome of the lawsuit.

That’s a pretty interesting Machiavellian scenario you found in BR. The speculation is just about far too well thought out by BR’s journalism standards. But, considering B1G’s unrequited infatuation with ND, the scenario may bear some truth. Nonetheless, I understand why you disclaimed it.

If Dulaney’s objective is to lure in ND, I think he would’ve been far better off extending a B1G invitation to BC and Navy, as opposed to MD and RU. Both BC and Navy are longtime rivals of ND, are located in the Boston and Baltimore/DC markets, respectively, and enjoy good academic reputations, although neither are AAU members. On the gridiron, Navy has fielded a better product than MD, even though MD has better talent. Navy also has greater national recognition. Neither BC nor RU delivers their respective markets, but ND has a rabid and larger fan base in the northeast than those two schools combined. Based on my observations as a NJ native, ND owns the NYC market. I wouldn’t be surprised if such were the case in Boston as well.

As far as destabilizing the ACC, it appears that the 11 member schools plus Pitt and Cuse (and possibly ND?) are rallying behind ACC Commissioner Swofford. Well…at least for the present time. The football powers got their way by voting for Louisville over UConn. And, as I mentioned above, the 11 are publicly united in the ACC’s lawsuit against MD. The fact that the football powers have finally asserted their authority over the Carolina schools appears to indicate that the ACC may not be trending down the same path that killed the Big East. But the football product will still suck and will continue to do so until the lessor, basketball-oriented schools show their committment to football.

I was disappointed that the ACC didn’t become the first 16 member superconference this week. I expected both Navy and UConn to accompany Louisville. I don’t understand Swofford’s timidity. There aren’t that many “good” schools remaining for the ACC to pick, especially if the ACC suffers from additional defections.

If the endgame is 16 member superconferences, then I wouldn’t discount any possible moves by the PAC 12. I just can’t imagine Pac 12 Commissioner Larry Scott sitting down ignoring the realignments that make the SEC and the B1G stronger. To that end, I expect the Big Twelve to be just as vulnerable as the ACC.

[Arslan]

Perhaps you ought to re-evaluate your friends.

A-hole.

Former childhood friends whose fathers taught them to lie and cheat to get ahead. My father taught at Princeton. Lying and cheating were strictly forbidden in my household.

A-hole. Yes by your definition...to the extent that I have greater loyalty to MD than the ACC.

[slapshot]

Arslan - just to comment quickly on why not Navy or BC? Well, the other issue on Dulaney's "to do list", is to expand the BTN market. Given the small viewership and alumni base for Navy and BC, this would not help that objective. Although I'm sure if Dulaney's was 100% sure that bringing in Navy would have enticed ND to join the B1G, he would have gone after Navy.

I truely believe that Dulaney is fixated on snagging ND, and that a lot of his strategy revolves around the end prize. After all, there has been a courtship of ND for decades. As it is, ND plays 3-4 members of the B1G every year, and is situated smack in the middle of Big Ten country. Their inclsuion is a natural. That said, I would bet my house that ND will never join the ACC is football. Say what you will about the Domers, it's still about the $$$...and as long as they have NBC and/ or the B1G chasing them with $$$, the ACC is a non-player. The ACC can not compete in the $$ game. The ONLY way I could see that changing would be if: NBC cancelled their contract with ND (won't happen), and/ or the ACC struck a deal with ND that allowed them to retain their exclusive contract with NBC and was allowed to reatain all the revenue (not shared with any ACC member). That was the sticking point with the B1G - ND negotiations.

[Arslan]

Arslan - just to comment quickly on why not Navy or BC? Well, the other issue on Dulaney's "to do list", is to expand the BTN market. Given the small viewership and alumni base for Navy and BC, this would not help that objective. Although I'm sure if Dulaney's was 100% sure that bringing in Navy would have enticed ND to join the B1G, he would have gone after Navy.

I truely believe that Dulaney is fixated on snagging ND, and that a lot of his strategy revolves around the end prize. That said, I would bet my house that ND will never join the ACC is football. Say what you will about the Domers, it's still about the $$$...and as long as they have NBC and/ or the B1G chasing them with $$$, the ACC is a non-player. The ACC can not compete in the $$ game. The ONLY way I could see that changing would be if: NBC cancelled their contract with ND (won't happen), and/ or the ACC struck a deal with ND that allowed them to retain their exclusive contract with NBC and was allowed to reatain all the revenue (not shared with any ACC member). That was the sticking point with the B1G - ND negotiations.

Well it appears their may some truth behind BR's speculation:

http://www.landgrantholyland.com/201...rence-expansio

SB Nation is even a less credible source than BR, but with realignment, you can't discount the story.

Btw, GT is also one of ND's longtime rivals.

[slapshot]

Well it appears their may some truth behind BR's speculation:

http://www.landgrantholyland.com/201...rence-expansio

SB Nation is even a less credible source than BR, but with realignment, you can't discount the story.

Btw, GT is also one of ND's longtime rivals.

The link didn't work.

The Purdue-Notre Dame rivalry dates back to 1896.

Not sure GT is a rival of ND? News to me.

Notre Dame has long running historic rivalries with University of Southern California, Navy, Purdue, and Michigan State University and an intermittent historic rivalry with the University of Michigan.[1] Recently, you can also add Stanford and BC to the list...but they are relative newcomers.

Bottom line: ND has a LONG history in playing Big Ten teams. Without their NBC contract, they would already be in the B1G.

[Eastside Terp]

from the Notre Dame page ......

Georgia Tech - This series began in 1922. The Yellow Jackets were a longtime rival of the Fighting Irish and the two teams met periodically on an annual basis over the years. When Georgia Tech, who had been an independent since 1963 when they dropped out of the Southeastern Conference, joined the Atlantic Coast Conference beginning in 1982, they were forced to end the series after 1981 because of scheduling difficulties. Consequently the two teams have met very infrequently since then. Georgia Tech was the opponent in the inaugural game in the newly expanded Notre Dame Stadium in 1997, then a year later they met again in the Gator Bowl. The Fighting Irish and Yellow Jackets met in the 2006 and 2007 season openers and split both games. Notre Dame holds a 27–6–1 edge in the series.[1]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notre_D...ball_rivalries

no sure what "met periodically on an annual basis over the years" means .....

from the Georgia Tech page .....

Notre Dame – The Georgia Tech-Notre Dame Fighting Irish football rivalry is infamous more for atrocious off-the-field behavior, rather than the actual games. Georgia Tech fans pelted the Notre Dame players, coaches, and visiting fans with fish and liquor bottles during the games played at Bobby Dodd Stadium during the 1960s and 1970s.[55] One of the more note worthy games was the 1980 3-3 slug fest at Grant Field during Bill Curry's first season, when then No.1 ranked Notre Dame left Grant Field with its hopes for a national championship in ruins, and once again the visitors were pelted with fish. The football game in 1975 was made famous nationwide in the movie Rudy, in which the Notre Dame player Rudy Ruettiger tackles the Georgia Tech quarterback Rudy Allen. Georgia Tech trails Notre Dame in the all time series 27-6-1.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgia...ckets_football

visited GT when one of my kids was looking at colleges and while walking around campus, saw an open gate at the football stadium .....

kid kept looking over her shoulder but got some pretty good pictures out on the field .....

[slapshot]

The last time ND played GT was 5 years ago. Nd had a home and home with GT in 06 and 07.
Prior to that??

IMO, not much of a rivalry.

Here are ND's rivals (for various reasons, they remain rivals):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notre_D...ball_rivalries

FYI - IMO, GT is a weird environment. My wife is from Atlanta. Been to GT many times. Good school, but not a college atmosphere...at least one that I would wish for my kids. Look beyond the academics, and look for the complete package. GT ain't it, IMO.

FYI - Do you know why ND will always comit to playing Navy, no mater how God awful they may be in some years?? Most don't know the history behind this rivalry, but the Capital (Annapolis) wrote an excellent history about the series. The short of it, ND almost went bankrupt during WWII, as all the able bodied men went off to war, ND could not meet pay rolls due to dropping attendance. The Navy came to the rescue, and used ND as a training facility during that period. The Navy basically saved ND from going out of business, and for that reason alone, will always honor their gratitude by playing Navy. Pretty neat story that not many know about. Not a Domer fan, but there's is classy act to repay Navy in this way.

[kudzu]

Flipping that around, most fans have no problem recruiting the one and done athlete - no matter how they do it. All in the name of winning.

I've argued against this practice for the simple reason that the one and done athlete does not represent the school. He doesn't embody any of the interests or love of the university that the rest of the students do. He has no interest in being there any longer than he has to. Yet, when he wins a championship, we fans claim WE are #1. The one and done is nothing more than a hired mercenary. So, if the university is guilty of buying a hired gun to win championships...then there should be no surprises that it's athletic department is also for sale.

Do you expect me to disagree with any of that ?