The Men Who Built America

[ms maggie]

They were also dividing up Poland with Hitler before Pearl Harbor. What a difference a few years makes.

Isn't that the truth. This war and its aftermath cast such a huge shadow over our world that it's easy to forget its relative brevity--42 thru mid 45, 3 1/2 years. Compare that to Afghanistan. Oy. Longer for Europeans of course, 6 years, but still.

[bullmikey]

They were also dividing up Poland with Hitler before Pearl Harbor. What a difference a few years makes.

A marriage of mere convenience. Both entered into it with the intent of betraying the other. Hitler was just ready to turn the screw sooner. Big mistake on his part. But what else could he do? How patient would Stalin have been had Hitler lost a very large part of his army attempting to get it across the Channel? That would have been an even bigger mistake, IMHO. But it might have shortened the war nearly as much as the invasion of Russia did.

[Seadog]

Isn't that the truth. This war and its aftermath cast such a huge shadow over our world that it's easy to forget its relative brevity--42 thru mid 45, 3 1/2 years. Compare that to Afghanistan. Oy. Longer for Europeans of course, 6 years, but still.

For the Chinese, the war started in 1931.

[veritas]

A marriage of mere convenience. Both entered into it with the intent of betraying the other. Hitler was just ready to turn the screw sooner. Big mistake on his part. But what else could he do? How patient would Stalin have been had Hitler lost a very large part of his army attempting to get it across the Channel? That would have been an even bigger mistake, IMHO. But it might have shortened the war nearly as much as the invasion of Russia did.

I don't think Hitler's heart was ever much into Operation Sea Lion. He initially opposed the idea of invading a country with people he saw as very close to the Germans and, in fact, whose Royal family were all of German stock. Plus, Britain, by itself, was no threat to the Germans' hold on France or much else in Europe. Only the entry of the US could swing the balance in the West. Had Hitler deferred on Barbarossa and been content to consolidate his hold over the rest of Europe, it would have made for a much longer struggle.

Also, I'm not sure how anxious the Russians would have been to get involved had they not been defending their own country. As they did with Japan, they may have been happy to see the US do the heavy lifting and then come in for the spoils at the end.

[CajunRaven]

And if Japan had not bombed Pearl Harbor, would the US have entered the war at all?

Impossible really to say.

There were alot of isolationists here at the time, so it is hard to say.

BTW, if you haven't the watched the series from the OP, it's really interesting.

[ms maggie]

There were alot of isolationists here at the time, so it is hard to say.

BTW, if you haven't the watched the series from the OP, it's really interesting.

I caught some of it, really interesting to see the personal side of these guys.

[bullmikey]

Isn't that the truth. This war and its aftermath cast such a huge shadow over our world that it's easy to forget its relative brevity--42 thru mid 45, 3 1/2 years. Compare that to Afghanistan. Oy. Longer for Europeans of course, 6 years, but still.

Duration is less impressive than the body count. Afghanistan is a minor skirmnish compared to WWII. On June 6, 1944 some 6,00 Americans were killed or wounded in less than 8 hours. That's just one day of WWII. Afghanistan isn't even close in what it's cost us. So much so that it's nearly a painless war for your average American, who goes about his or her day without having to think about it. WWII, there was a lot of pain everywhere. There was no forgetting the war; it was in just about everyone's living room. Not on the boob tube like Vietnam was, but in the empty chairs and missing faces. Wars shouldn't be as cheap as they are these days, then we might not be so anxious to fight them. Bu tif it doesn't touch you where you live...? Well, you see my point.

[ms maggie]

Duration is less impressive than the body count. Afghanistan is a minor skirmnish compared to WWII. On June 6, 1944 some 6,00 Americans were killed or wounded in less than 8 hours. That's just one day of WWII. Afghanistan isn't even close in what it's cost us. So much so that it's nearly a painless war for your average American, who goes about his or her day without having to think about it. WWII, there was a lot of pain everywhere. There was no forgetting the war; it was in just about everyone's living room. Not on the boob tube like Vietnam was, but in the empty chairs and missing faces. Wars shouldn't be as cheap as they are these days, then we might not be so anxious to fight them. Bu tif it doesn't touch you where you live...? Well, you see my point.

Hey I think if there are going to be wars, there needs to be a draft. My husband and I have a very large circle of friends and acquaintances, and of course with 5 kids in their 20s, that's a lot of people we know---I know ONE person who has been to Afghanistan. It's a disgrace. Personally I would like to see mandatory service of two years after high school--not all military, there's lots of stuff young people could do to contribute to the country beyond the service--conservation, FEMA as examples. Would give them perspective and maturity prior to setting on a career path.

[flyboy56]

How the hell did we go from America's Industrial Titans to WWII? Started another topic!

[The Astute Reader(tm)]

Losses? And without a western front those losses would have been even more, maybe enough that German armor reaches Moscow before the snow encircles Stalingrad.

And after reaching Moscow the Germans have only conquered about 1/4 of Russia.

We Americans do love to blow our own horn but the reality is that our contribution was to speed up the inevitable.

[CajunRaven]

How the hell did we go from America's Industrial Titans to WWII? Started another topic!

Welcome to Sunspot!

[BlandFood]

And after reaching Moscow the Germans have only conquered about 1/4 of Russia.

We Americans do love to blow our own horn but the reality is that our contribution was to speed up the inevitable.

And east of that was largely uninhabited wilderness.

[The Astute Reader(tm)]

And east of that was largely uninhabited wilderness.

Into which Stalin had moved much of Russia's military industry, safely out of reach by German aircraft. Is that the uninhabited wilderness to which you refer?

[BlandFood]

Into which Stalin had moved much of Russia's military industry, safely out of reach by German aircraft. Is that the uninhabited wilderness to which you refer?

East of the Urals specifically and yes so what about it?

[The Astute Reader(tm)]

East of the Urals specifically and yes so what about it?

I would think the import of that to be self-evident.