Lets just go over the cliff. Our debt isn't getting any smaller

[Calamari]

But 2% is still only 2%.

That's the growth rate column, not % as GDP.

[flyboy56]

Semi, did you read the article?

The column is correct in that nothing that will be proposed by Democrats or Republicans will cause more deficit reduction than going over the cliff...

But will the surplus savings be used to pay down the national debt? What did Clinton do with the surplus he realized? He certainly didn't use it to pay down the debt as it continued to climb throughout his 8 year term.

[ivanbalt]

That's the growth rate column, not % as GDP.

Ok, a 10% reduction as % of GDP seems a little better, but not what I call drastic.

[pickles]

Ok, a 10% reduction as % of GDP seems a little better, but not what I call drastic.

Fair enough.

And what has trickle-down economics done to the debt and deficit?

And should we continue w that philosophy?

[flyboy56]

Fair enough.

And what has trickle-down economics done to the debt and deficit?

And should we continue w that philosophy?

Obama and Bernanke are using trickle down economics with stimulus and QE's. If you don't think they are then explain why not?

[pickles]

Obama and Bernanke are using trickle down economics with stimulus and QE's. If you don't think they are then explain why not?

You honestly don't understand the difference between stimulus and trickle down economics?

[flyboy56]

You honestly don't understand the difference between stimulus and trickle down economics?

Then explain it to me.

[pickles]

Then explain it to me.

I'll do it as quickly and simply as I can.

Stimulus is the Fed sending money to the states, which they then use to pay their teachers, and firefighters, and policeman, etc. Or you know, the middle class. They also use it for public works, which, again, employs the middle class.

Trickle down is the Fed cutting taxes largely for the rich, which is offshored, and hidden.

If trickle down economics worked, then why the wealth gap expanded precipitously in the last 30 years?

[CajunRaven]

A little short-term pain for long-term gain:

Thanks just the same, but how about you guys go off the cliff without me.

I'm paying my fair share of taxes now and don't need their hand in my pocket anymore than it already is.

[CajunRaven]

'Our?'

No, that would be 'your' debt for your programs and spending.

Byngo!

[flyboy56]

I'll do it as quickly and simply as I can.

Stimulus is the Fed sending money to the states, which they then use to pay their teachers, and firefighters, and policeman, etc. Or you know, the middle class. They also use it for public works, which, again, employs the middle class.

Trickle down is the Fed cutting taxes largely for the rich, which is offshored, and hidden.

If trickle down economics worked, then why the wealth gap expanded precipitously in the last 30 years?

Are you sure you're not forgetting something else?

The government stepped in to try to prevent the situation from getting as bad as the Great Depression, which lasted for over a decade. By providing stimulus money to individuals, the government helped people to continue to live in their homes while looking for jobs. The stimulus money provided to businesses was intended to help them to invest money in capital assets such as building new homes and offices. This was expected to result in new construction, which in turn provides jobs and eventually alleviates the need for unemployment payments, government-managed health care, and other direct benefits.

http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-stimulus-money.htm

[Grindelwald]

To be honest I think going over the cliff would be a bad thing. I think the Republicans should take Obama's offer. But then again, they aren't that bright.

[dsummoner]

'Stimulus' is the Obamanian regime providing the kickbacks to the unionized government grub slugs for providing 'the juice' for their support for him.

[pickles]

Are you sure you're not forgetting something else?

The government stepped in to try to prevent the situation from getting as bad as the Great Depression, which lasted for over a decade. By providing stimulus money to individuals, the government helped people to continue to live in their homes while looking for jobs. The stimulus money provided to businesses was intended to help them to invest money in capital assets such as building new homes and offices. This was expected to result in new construction, which in turn provides jobs and eventually alleviates the need for unemployment payments, government-managed health care, and other direct benefits.

http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-stimulus-money.htm

What's your point? The money still ends up a lot more in Main St. hands through 'stimulus' than Wall St. hands, through trickle down.

Stimulus is not perfect. I never claimed that. There is waste.

However, if trickle down is the better way to go, why don't you explain that to me. I'm all ears.

[pickles]

'Stimulus' is the Obamanian regime providing the kickbacks to the unionized government grub slugs for providing 'the juice' for their support for him.

And trickle down is the GOP regimes providing the kickbacks to the fascist corporations that buy their add time in election season.

Funny how that works.

[soulflower]

Thanks just the same, but how about you guys go off the cliff without me.

I'm paying my fair share of taxes now and don't need their hand in my pocket anymore than it already is.

Tax increases are inevitable. We can either pay a little more now or pay a lot more later.

[flyboy56]

What's your point? The money still ends up a lot more in Main St. hands through 'stimulus' than Wall St. hands, through trickle down.

Stimulus is not perfect. I never claimed that. There is waste.

However, if trickle down is the better way to go, why don't you explain that to me. I'm all ears.

What's my point? Really?! My point is it's trickle down economics just like QE. Programs approved by Obama. The same guy who says growing the economy from the middle class out is the best economic plan. These are the same plans that are ridiculed by liberals. So where are the plans for growing the middle class out?

[flyboy56]

Tax increases are inevitable. We can either pay a little more now or pay a lot more later.

Before anyone pays one dime of new taxes we should demand a bill be passed which requires all surplus monies be used to pay down the national debt.

[pickles]

What's my point? Really?! My point is it's trickle down economics just like QE. Programs approved by Obama. The same guy who says growing the economy from the middle class out is the best economic plan. These are the same plans that are ridiculed by liberals. So where are the plans for growing the middle class out?

I fail to see how QE is solely a benefit for the 1%, though they do benefit greatly from it.

I don't see how massive tax cuts, aimed largely at the rich, and the deregulation of markets, doesn't solely benefit the 1%.

The rich get richer, man, under almost any economic policy. That can't be denied.

However, again, explain to me how trickle down economics has or can benefit the middle class. I bet you can't do, because history shows that not to be the case.

[dsummoner]

And trickle down is the GOP regimes providing the kickbacks to the fascist corporations that buy their add time in election season.

Funny how that works.

Fascist corporations such as your Obama's General Motors or your Obama's big investment banks?