And I never said that Bernie was HoF-worthy. In fact, I specifically said he was not, but that I could understand why the 19 guys that voted for him (and the 55 last year) did. I'm surprised Singleton didn't even get a single vote in his first year. Opinions differ. Heck, I don't think Mattingly is worthy, but he's been on the ballot for 13 years. He had a border-line career, so I don't begrudge him the votes he got.
watch David Ortiz when he's eligible. I bet he gets the highest % of votes any career DH has received. is he better than Baines or Edgar? maybe, but not by much. I am convinced he'll get a much better reception than those two, because he played for Boston all these years.
bonds, clemens and others made enough money for multiple lifetimes....some even managed to make multiple lifetimes worth of money without cheating...who knew? it wasn't greed, it was vanity and a deep sense of insecurity....
on a side note, I didn't think it humanly possible for anyone to be more of an overblown pompous rear end than our resident radio hack/identity thief, but you sir, have supplanted him as the most annoying person on this board...well done, very well done....
Let me help you - the O's go 84-78 in 2013 and miss the playoffs. Have a great day.
as for childish insults...I guess when you are as ancient as you claim to be, anyone under 80 is considered a child in your eyes....
Vlad's looking for you...something about needing a ball wash....didn't know he golfed....
There isn't a single drug that can make me pitch as well as Roger Clemens or hit as well as Barry Bonds. I don't have the physical or mental ability to do what they did.
I'm sure the same rules apply, albeit to a lesser extent, among the peers of Clemens and Bonds...
I think everyone agrees that Bonds and Clemens would have had HOF careers, even if PEDs didn't exist in the world. that can't be said for any other player. not even Sosa.
as for the rest, there were better ball players who lost their job to players who bulked up thru chemicals. it's hard to make a work-a-day analogy to that. but I'm confident you wouldn't feel the same way if you lost your job and career to someone else because they were willing to use illegal practices to outproduce you.
some people believe it's an issue of morality, and others don't believe morality has a place in baseball or the decision making process.
Steroids isn't going to turn a guy like Jay Gibbons into a hall of famer. One could even argue that taking PEDs is worth the risk for players who are borderline major leaguers and have no realistic chance of becoming Hall of Famers.
As far as elite players go, a guy like Ken Griffey, who no one suspects of juicing, made a ton of money and had a great career despite not doing what Bonds did. The only real consequence was that his career was shortened by injuries(which seemed likely to happen to Bonds before he went to BALCO).
I'll be shocked if Griffey or Jeter don't get voted in on the first ballot.
but to clarify, I'm specifically talking about the guys who were only able to have a MLB career because they were using PEDs. I have every confidence that these borderline guys were given roster spots over guys who were naturally better ball players, but they didn't win out because they didn't cheat, and a lesser players did.
there's no combination of PEDs that could have made Gibbons a HOF caliber player. if there were, he would have taken them. and he too would have been snubbed when he got on his first ballot. without PEDs, Gibbons would have had a cup of coffee in baseball, and then went on to a different life, thus clearing some room for a better, more deserving player.
there's very little to feel sorry about for a guy like Griffey. he may be the best player I've ever seen play the game. he was a 5 tool player. but if there is something to be sad about, it's that he will be overshadowed by all the stink of lesser players like Sosa, McGwire and Bonds.
but I doubt he's shedding any tears about that.
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