AZ Republicans Absurd HS Pledge

[Bmoreteacher]

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendl...e-high-school/

A group of Arizona politicians — all Republicans, of course — have proposed a law (House Bill 2467) requiring public high school students to recite the following oath in order to graduate:

I, _______, do solemnly swear that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge these duties; So help me God.

Hmm, I will support and defend the Constitution, yet trample on students' 1st Amendment rights? What is the point of this oath? I wonder if the people who whine that state legislators waste taxpayers' time when discussing marriage equality would take offense to this use of time.

[Grindelwald]

Absolutely incredible and so rich with irony.

[ivanbalt]

So high school graduates are now in the military? Idiots.

[flyboy56]

Quite a telling response coming from all of you. First the Pledge of Allegiance and now you find a problem with making a pledge to support the Constitution?

[Bmoreteacher]

Quite a telling response coming from all of you. First the Pledge of Allegiance and now you find a problem with making a pledge to support the Constitution?

Nice spin...I think its pretty clear that the problem we have with this is forcing students to say they believe in God.

[EmDot]

Suppose the person is a foreign exchange student?

[bmorepunk]

Bill text:

AN ACT

AMENDING TITLE 15, CHAPTER 7, ARTICLE 1, ARIZONA REVISED STATUTES, BY ADDING SECTION 15-701.03; RELATING TO SCHOOL CURRICULUM.


(TEXT OF BILL BEGINS ON NEXT PAGE)



Be it enacted by the Legislature of the State of Arizona:
Section 1. Title 15, chapter 7, article 1, Arizona Revised Statutes, is amended by adding section 15-701.03, to read:
15-701.03. Graduation requirement; constitutional oath
BEGINNING IN THE 2013‑2014 SCHOOL YEAR, IN ADDITION TO FULFILLING THE COURSE OF STUDY AND ASSESSMENT REQUIREMENTS PRESCRIBED IN THIS CHAPTER, BEFORE A PUPIL IS ALLOWED TO GRADUATE FROM A PUBLIC HIGH SCHOOL IN THIS STATE, THE PRINCIPAL OR HEAD TEACHER OF THE SCHOOL SHALL VERIFY IN WRITING THAT THE PUPIL HAS RECITED THE FOLLOWING OATH:
I, _________, DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR THAT I WILL SUPPORT AND DEFEND THE CONSTITUTION OF THE UNITED STATES AGAINST ALL ENEMIES, FOREIGN AND DOMESTIC, THAT I WILL BEAR TRUE FAITH AND ALLEGIANCE TO THE SAME; THAT I TAKE THIS OBLIGATION FREELY, WITHOUT ANY MENTAL RESERVATION OR PURPOSE OF EVASION; AND THAT I WILL WELL AND FAITHFULLY DISCHARGE THESE DUTIES; SO HELP ME GOD.

Do you think that if they liked the current President they'd leave in the part about the President from the US Armed Forces oath of enlistment that they copied? Do they realize that "So help me God" statement is actually optional when you take an oath the the country?

Do Arizona legislators enjoy setting up fights that will eventually lead to legal battles that can find their way to the Supreme Court?

It's ridiculous and crazy, but I'm not putting this past the legislative and executive in that state. This sort of thing just doesn't affect atheists.

The totalitarian irony here is disturbing.

[Bmoreteacher]

Bill text:



Do you think that if they liked the current President they'd leave in the part about the President from the US Armed Forces oath of enlistment that they copied? Do they realize that "So help me God" statement is actually optional when you take an oath the the country?

Do Arizona legislators enjoy setting up fights that will eventually lead to legal battles that can find their way to the Supreme Court?

It's ridiculous and crazy, but I'm not putting this past the legislative and executive in that state. This sort of thing just doesn't affect atheists.

The totalitarian irony here is disturbing.

I was reading an article earlier about how Republicans are still in shock at their blowout in November and they're basically trying to redo their image. I'd say it starts with ousting morons like this.

[bmorepunk]

Suppose the person is a foreign exchange student?

Generally their home countries won't accept their graduation under our standards, but if they do this would certainly be interesting.

[ivanbalt]

I was reading an article earlier about how Republicans are still in shock at their blowout in November and they're basically trying to redo their image. I'd say it starts with ousting morons like this.

It's almost like they are doubling-down on the insanity.

[Bmoreteacher]

It's almost like they are doubling-down on the insanity.

And notice that our conservative brethren won't even touch this thread or the rape thread? They're so quick to attack Obama, yet they refuse to acknowledge how bad things have gotten within the ranks of the GOP.

[regularguy]

Quite a telling response coming from all of you. First the Pledge of Allegiance and now you find a problem with making a pledge to support the Constitution?

The Supreme Court ruled - 70 years ago! - that public school students can't be required to recite the Pledge of Allegiance. And you want students to additionally be required to affirm the existence of "God"?

Which would you rather have get a diploma... a straight-A student who happens to be atheist or agnostic and who takes an oath seriously, or a slacker D-student who is an atheist or agnostic but thinks nothing of mindlessly reciting an false oath?

[Calamari]

So the repugs want you have to recant atheism now to graduate HS in AZ? Just another reason that state is going down the craphole of history.

[flyboy56]

The Supreme Court ruled - 70 years ago! - that public school students can't be required to recite the Pledge of Allegiance. And you want students to additionally be required to affirm the existence of "God"?

Which would you rather have get a diploma... a straight-A student who happens to be atheist or agnostic and who takes an oath seriously, or a slacker D-student who is an atheist or agnostic but thinks nothing of mindlessly reciting an false oath?

How about a hard working student regardless of grades and believes in the existence of God and truly believes in the oath(s) he/she is reciting? Yep, the old days when there was a lot less mass murders taken place even though guns were plentiful.

[bmorepunk]

How about a hard working student regardless of grades and believes in the existence of God and truly believes in the oath(s) he/she is reciting? Yep, the old days when there was a lot less mass murders taken place even though guns were plentiful.

There were a lot more mass murders during the 1920s and 1930s, back when religion supposedly made people better. The 1960s were a particularly heavy time for the activity. The lethality has improved because of more efficient means to kill, but mass murder has a long, rich history in the United States. It's as American as apple pie.

Read Mass Murder in the United States: A History by Grant Duwe. It has an actual historical compilation, instead of people remembering the "good old days".

[Bmoreteacher]

How about a hard working student regardless of grades and believes in the existence of God and truly believes in the oath(s) he/she is reciting? Yep, the old days when there was a lot less mass murders taken place even though guns were plentiful.

Then those students are able to say an oath by themselves. You can't force kids to make an oath that goes against their religion or personal beliefs. If you think an 18 year old taking an oath will reduce mass murders, you've got another thing coming.

[regularguy]

How about a hard working student regardless of grades and believes in the existence of God and truly believes in the oath(s) he/she is reciting?

I have no issue at all with such a student. And this law wouldn't affect them in any way.

What's your point? Do you actually think all 18-year-olds need to believe in a god - or pretend to - in order to get a high school diploma?

[Baltimatt]

How about a hard working student regardless of grades and believes in the existence of God and truly believes in the oath(s) he/she is reciting? Yep, the old days when there was a lot less mass murders taken place even though guns were plentiful.

What about such a student? The issue is not about God-believing students, but about requiring students to mention God even if they don't believe.