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Orioles are so bad their Hall of Fame would finish last in the AL East


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#1 weenie

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Posted 14 April 2012 - 10:51 AM

After the last 25 years of mostly abysmal baseball in Baltimore, the Orioles advocates have added enough marginal players to their HOF to stock a team that would likely finish last in the AL east against the current competition if the players' average O's performance were meshed together individually. Consider the following:

C - Hoiles, Hendricks, Dempsey
1B - May, Gentile
2B - Dauer
SS - Bordick, Belanger
3B - DeCinces
OF - Surhoff, Anderson, Buford, Woodling, Blair
DH - Baines
SP - Pappas, Barber, Brown, Martinez
RP - Watt, Hall, Wilhelm, Miller, Olson

It would be a team with good D and a few decent relievers (Olson) but many of the current Orioles HOF members listed above had their best years elsewhere (Baines, Woodling, May, DeCinces, Wilhelm) and a few others really only had one or two big years (Gentile, Hoiles, Pappas, Barber, Anderson) in Baltimore. Still, a few others were always marginal (Dauer, Hendricks, Brown, Watt) and some were only a bit better than average (Surhoff, Dempsey, Buford, Miller, Hall).

Guys like Belanger, Blair, Dempsey, Miller, Olson and Hall should be in the O's HOF but the rest are mostly pushes.

Sadly, the Orioles Advocates have joined Mr. Angelos in tarnishing another aspect of our Orioles memories. The national HOF passes some years on player inductees but the local guys don't! Be a bit more choosy in the future folks so we don't see Roberts, Tejada, Mora and comparably nice but not quite there guys get in!

#2 TravisMoon

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Posted 14 April 2012 - 10:53 AM

This is stupid.

Where's Brooks, Frank, Cal, Murray, Palmer, Cuellar, Mussina, McNally, Flanagan...etc?

Nice selective straw man build. Total lameness.

TM
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#3 durango46

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Posted 14 April 2012 - 10:57 AM

I'm thinking someone plucked someone elses nerves.....

#4 weenie

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Posted 14 April 2012 - 10:59 AM

Dude, did you read the post? The point was to show how so many HOFers are so inferior to the guys you mentioned. No one would exclude Frank, Brooks, etc. and I'm all for guys like McGregor, Mussina, etc. being members but Chris Hoiles, Steve Barber, Eddie Watt? Come on man. Look at that list. That's no HOF quality talent and there are more guys like that in the O's HOF than the others we all venerate. The Orioles Advocates too often insist on putting in an annual addition to appease the folks at the luncheon when it might be preferable to bring back a guy who's already in the Hall to speak to the members instead? Get it? I didn't think so. Enjoy those Orange colored glasses.

#5 TravisMoon

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Posted 14 April 2012 - 11:13 AM

Dude, did you read the post? The point was to show how so many HOFers are so inferior to the guys you mentioned. No one would exclude Frank, Brooks, etc. and I'm all for guys like McGregor, Mussina, etc. being members but Chris Hoiles, Steve Barber, Eddie Watt? Come on man. Look at that list. That's no HOF quality talent and there are more guys like that in the O's HOF than the others we all venerate. The Orioles Advocates too often insist on putting in an annual addition to appease the folks at the luncheon when it might be preferable to bring back a guy who's already in the Hall to speak to the members instead? Get it? I didn't think so. Enjoy those Orange colored glasses.


No I don't get it.

You are crafting a blatant strawman argument by saying a "selectively" put together list of Orioles HOF would finish last place WHILE purposely leaving off the best the Orioles ever had. It is a STRAWMAN.

I know you think the Orioles suck and all, but this is a ridiculous way of selling your Oriole hate.

TM
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] "The Preying Matusz" devours another batter!

#6 hector

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Posted 14 April 2012 - 11:23 AM

After the last 25 years of mostly abysmal baseball in Baltimore, the Orioles advocates have added enough marginal players to their HOF to stock a team that would likely finish last in the AL east against the current competition if the players' average O's performance were meshed together individually. Consider the following:

C - Hoiles, Hendricks, Dempsey
1B - May, Gentile
2B - Dauer
SS - Bordick, Belanger
3B - DeCinces
OF - Surhoff, Anderson, Buford, Woodling, Blair
DH - Baines
SP - Pappas, Barber, Brown, Martinez
RP - Watt, Hall, Wilhelm, Miller, Olson

It would be a team with good D and a few decent relievers (Olson) but many of the current Orioles HOF members listed above had their best years elsewhere (Baines, Woodling, May, DeCinces, Wilhelm) and a few others really only had one or two big years (Gentile, Hoiles, Pappas, Barber, Anderson) in Baltimore. Still, a few others were always marginal (Dauer, Hendricks, Brown, Watt) and some were only a bit better than average (Surhoff, Dempsey, Buford, Miller, Hall).

Guys like Belanger, Blair, Dempsey, Miller, Olson and Hall should be in the O's HOF but the rest are mostly pushes.

Sadly, the Orioles Advocates have joined Mr. Angelos in tarnishing another aspect of our Orioles memories. The national HOF passes some years on player inductees but the local guys don't! Be a bit more choosy in the future folks so we don't see Roberts, Tejada, Mora and comparably nice but not quite there guys get in!


Out of 24 names mentioned, there's one Latino. Enough said - consider the obvious.

#7 weenie

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Posted 14 April 2012 - 11:28 AM

No I don't get it.

You are crafting a blatant strawman argument by saying a "selectively" put together list of Orioles HOF would finish last place WHILE purposely leaving off the best the Orioles ever had. It is a STRAWMAN.

I know you think the Orioles suck and all, but this is a ridiculous way of selling your Oriole hate.

TM


Actually, if you have read my prior posts, I am more often in your camp than not. I like the lineup, bullpen and have hope for the starters in 2012 and see arms and talent on the way in the minors to fill the gaps going forward. The O's may not up to NY standards but I could see a 3rd place finish in '12 (behind NY and Tampa...sorry Sox fans).

My point was and is to express disappointment at the bulk of members now in the local HOF. The advocates have cheapened the institution by feeling it necessary to add in guys who simply aren't fit to carry Brooks' jockstrap. Guys who did their best elsewhere (Wilhelm, Baines, Woodling) or otherwise got in by sheer longevity (Hoiles) make the Hall less than prestigious. I'm all for guys like Cuellar, McNally, Belanger, Dempsey, Singleton, Blair and many more getting in. They each might not meet national HOF standards but the O's hall serves as a nice second tier reward for the memories we all treasure.

However, when does addition dilute validity? After so many recent years of poor performance, we now see an institution adding players who either flashed for only a year or two or did their best elsewhere. How long before Larry Sheets, Mike Young and Ben McDonald get added? I can get myself around the idea of an occasional Steve Stone but guys like Baines in the hall are a joke!

#8 weenie

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Posted 14 April 2012 - 11:32 AM

Out of 24 names mentioned, there's one Latino. Enough said - consider the obvious.


No one ever said latinos can't play ball. My favorite O all time was Cuellar. Loved that screwball! In the 60's it seemed like the NL gave more opportunities to latino players. Mike started in Houston and it was reported the Astros thought he was done when they traded him for Blefary.

Now Vlad.....that dude is worn out and every major league team knows it. Even the Indians chose Damon over the guy.

#9 hst2

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Posted 14 April 2012 - 11:44 AM

I wonder if some of them qualified based, in part, on their contributions to the community.
"It is even harder for the average ape to believe that he has descended from man. - HL Mencken

#10 hector

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Posted 14 April 2012 - 11:50 AM

No one ever said latinos can't play ball. My favorite O all time was Cuellar. Loved that screwball! In the 60's it seemed like the NL gave more opportunities to latino players. Mike started in Houston and it was reported the Astros thought he was done when they traded him for Blefary.

Now Vlad.....that dude is worn out and every major league team knows it. Even the Indians chose Damon over the guy.


The Indians chose Damon over two former O's - Vlad and Pie. Shameful.

#11 AntiMoon

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Posted 14 April 2012 - 11:51 AM

After the last 25 years of mostly abysmal baseball in Baltimore, the Orioles advocates have added enough marginal players to their HOF to stock a team that would likely finish last in the AL east against the current competition if the players' average O's performance were meshed together individually. Consider the following:

C - Hoiles, Hendricks, Dempsey
1B - May, Gentile
2B - Dauer
SS - Bordick, Belanger
3B - DeCinces
OF - Surhoff, Anderson, Buford, Woodling, Blair
DH - Baines
SP - Pappas, Barber, Brown, Martinez
RP - Watt, Hall, Wilhelm, Miller, Olson

It would be a team with good D and a few decent relievers (Olson) but many of the current Orioles HOF members listed above had their best years elsewhere (Baines, Woodling, May, DeCinces, Wilhelm) and a few others really only had one or two big years (Gentile, Hoiles, Pappas, Barber, Anderson) in Baltimore. Still, a few others were always marginal (Dauer, Hendricks, Brown, Watt) and some were only a bit better than average (Surhoff, Dempsey, Buford, Miller, Hall).

Guys like Belanger, Blair, Dempsey, Miller, Olson and Hall should be in the O's HOF but the rest are mostly pushes.

Sadly, the Orioles Advocates have joined Mr. Angelos in tarnishing another aspect of our Orioles memories. The national HOF passes some years on player inductees but the local guys don't! Be a bit more choosy in the future folks so we don't see Roberts, Tejada, Mora and comparably nice but not quite there guys get in!

I'd gladly take Hoiles,Gentile, Surhoff,Anderson,Baines,Blair,Martinez,Olson,Willhelm and Watt and challenge for the AL East title
Only 48 days til hockey season.
Only 31 days til football season.

#12 AntiMoon

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Posted 14 April 2012 - 11:54 AM

Current O's lineup would be
Anderson LF
Blair CF
Markakis RF
Gentile 1B
Surhoff 3B
Hardy SS
Baines DH
Wieters/Hoiles C
Andino 2B

Starters
D Martinez
M Pappas
J Arrieta
Z Britton
J Hammel/T Hunter
Bullpen
Olson
Watt
Wilhelm
J Johnson
L Ayala
D O'Day
P Strop
Only 48 days til hockey season.
Only 31 days til football season.

#13 pitbull

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Posted 14 April 2012 - 03:34 PM

"Total lameness," says the Worthless Troll, who has No Credibility on this Forum.

#14 Softbank Orioles

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Posted 14 April 2012 - 05:02 PM

I've been as frustrated with the O's as much as anyone but you're wrong here.

Surhoff in his brief prime was one of the most productive outfielders in baseball. No, he wasn't a chemical freak show like Sosa and Bonds were at the time but he was good. His 1999 season was awesome. 28 hr+ 200+ hits. 104 runs.

He's in the Orioles HOF because he was a fan favorite and didn't want to leave. That's what these things are about.


Dempsey comes from a different era, and anchored the best staffs around. Actually had some OK offensive years. Bad average, but serviceable OBP for a defensive catcher.

But he's in there on personality and durability. You know why Elrod is in there. Chris Hoiles was a great player. Go look at his OBP numbers.

Bordick is one of the best defenders we've ever had. He could hit. He wasn't A-Rod or Ripken but he was good. Another guy in there just because the fans loved him. You know why Belanger is in there. We happened to have a very good team in 97 with Mike.

Doug DeCinces was a good player. His biggest year was in California though.

Brady was an OBP machine and owns the Orioles HR record. Of course he's on there.

Buford played on three Orioles WS teams. Three years of an OBP over .395 for us.

What's wrong with Paul Blair?

Baines had several very good/ seasons for us. More importantly, Baines is a LOCAL GUY. Of course we put Baines in. He was awesome and he's one of us.

Hoyt was one of the first very good players the Orioles ever had, and is a legend.

That's as far as I'm going with this.




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