Jump to content



Recent headlines from The Baltimore Sun

Photo
- - - - -

Has MLB Legalized POT for GM's?


  • Please log in to reply
14 replies to this topic

#1 escheinersold

escheinersold

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 646 posts

Posted 18 November 2013 - 01:59 PM

I really would like to hear your wisdom on this. 

 

Well seems Olney has picked up on the subject and commented http://insider.espn..../post/_/id/3829.

If Olney is correct Boras as usuual has sett a number from another planet. Okay a starting point. So what is a number that is the real value for Matt in say a 6-7 year deal? Is $10-$12 real average? I look at the Twins and they are stuck with a bad contract.

"IF" this cannot happen and "IF" this article is real fantasy of Boras and Matt what can we do but trade now?

If arbitration numbers at $14 mil does that really justify a $14 mill per yr contract base for Matt?

 

And "IF" we are to try to sign Davis to a long term deal to, what is Davis value on the market? This is a one year anamoly? Something to continue? "IF" "IF". Is Davis worth $20 per year for 5-6 years.? I am a proponent of paying for value. I am one that recognizes you must pay for success. That is "IF" you want it to continue. 

 

I am amazed at the numbers we are talking. One year performers Scherzer, Davis,.... Picking up fortunes with only "A Posiisbility" they will continue. No one can afford to say only a Hail Mary. I must go to the full rosary for this much hope. 

 

Contracts that need to be addressed this winter include Weiters, Davis, Hardy, Tillman, Johnson, McLouth, Roberts, Feldman,.. I am looking at those free agents reportedly the media describes as wanted back.  I understand the TV money is increasing significantly for the Orioles. How is MASN doing? What is a realistic budget for the Orioles with the market we are in? 

 

Should the Orioles be considering (and maybe the smoke is real on the trade front) in trades for Hardy, Johnson and Weiters? Bring in young, fertile talent with loads of pitching arms. Even my fan desire for success and a world series crown has a Realistic View of what Reality looks like. Paying Matt $184 mil for 9 years is a pure joke. As you remember I love having him here and think he is the Best catcher in MLB. What marketplace is going to even come near? Or has MLB legalized the use of POT for MLB GM's?


Edited by escheinersold, 18 November 2013 - 01:59 PM.

Ed So Pa Fan
:P

#2 bmore_ken

bmore_ken

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 55,219 posts

Posted 18 November 2013 - 02:28 PM

I'll condense my response. On the Weiters front, If it was my money I'm not giving him $14M per for 8 or 9 years. To start with his bat is not supporting that number in my opinion. I believe like you he's definitely the best defensive catcher in the league and he handles pitchers well. Is that worth $14M per? Not my money, especially when that contract will be worthless to the team towards the end of it. That being said, I do think it's quite possible someone else will kick out that kind of dough for him.

 

Davis? He's under contract for next season(and I think the season after) so we have all next season to see if this was a one year fluke. To me it's pretty obvious he won't hit another 50 next year, but I think it's quite possible he lands around his 2012 numbers. You have to remember he only played 139 games in 2012. If he'd played 155-160 he could quite possibly have been around 40 HRs easy. If he hits 30-35 next season he's going to be in demand.

 

Hardy in my mind is the best trade candidate if you're not trying to extend him. He hits for power and plays great at SS, like Davis he'll be in demand next season. I personally don't want Roberts back unless it's cheap. Some will disagree but I think Johnson is expendable. I say if someone wants to pay him crazy money to blow saves, let them. McClouth keep at the right price, I think you can find another inexpensive option for his role and numbers. Tillman you have to sign at all costs for obvious reasons and Feldman I have a suspicion is going to be priced out of Peta Boy's set budget. He's a starting pitcher that can give you quality innings. You don't have to break the bank to sign him but I think some team is going to be willing to pay him decently though for what he brings to the table


Secretary of State Hillary Clinton. It has a nice sound to it

Suggs has signed. I've never been so happy to be wrong

Don't blame me, I voted Bob Barr:cool:

#3 weird-O

weird-O

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 13,385 posts
  • LocationI'm here from downtown, I'm here from Mitch and Murray.

Posted 18 November 2013 - 03:26 PM

extending contracts of in-house players is something PGA has always had a hard time with. he has done it, but not often. he always wants the hometown discount. really good players don't have to do that, and they usually don't.

 

they needed to offer Davis an ext. at the end of 2012. now, I'm sure you're thinking that's hindsight talking. but it isn't. Buck knew what CD could be. and when he was given half a chance, he hit 35 dingers. given a full chance, he smashed a few O's records for offensive production. Buck was right about CD, and 2012 should have been all the proof they needed. they should have jumped on that inside information when they had the chance. now they'll pay a much more handsome fee to keep him. and honestly, it will probably be more than PGA will allow.

 

as for Wieters, all signs point to his desire to leave. I mentioned before that I talked to an inside source with the O's, who told me MW can't wait to leave. if I know that, the O's know that. but they're torn between trading him now, or keeping him for a 2014 run at the pennant. there's the dilemma. he's a great asset, even if he isn't a long term asset. but they shouldn't dedicate that kind of contract term to a (will be) 30 year old FA catcher that's already showing signs of fatigue from being the backstop. 5 yrs max term. as for $$$, here's some context. Posey will earn $16.5M in 2015. and that salary jumps up to $20M in '16 and eventually $21.4M thru '22. that makes MW worth $14M or more, for a teams that can/is willing to pay it. the biggest problem with the MW situation is that the O's have no one in the farm system that is a legitimate replacement.

 

Hardy is tricky because Manny wants to move over to SS. Tillman should be given an extension. pay him now, or pay him more later. the reality is, they'll pay him less now, and let him walk later. 


"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damn lies, and statistics." - Benjamin Disraeli

#4 Gizmo

Gizmo

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 2,720 posts

Posted 18 November 2013 - 04:53 PM

 

as for Wieters, all signs point to his desire to leave. I mentioned before that I talked to an inside source with the O's, who told me MW can't wait to leave. if I know that, the O's know that. 

 

weird-O, I ask this out of curiosity. Was any reason given for Matt wanting to get out of Baltimore that you would feel comfortable with saying?



#5 Rael

Rael

    Rational member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 9,588 posts

Posted 18 November 2013 - 05:47 PM

weird-O, I ask this out of curiosity. Was any reason given for Matt wanting to get out of Baltimore that you would feel comfortable with saying?

 

Have you been paying attention for the last 15 years?


Pessimism is just an ugly word for 'pattern recognition'.

#6 Gizmo

Gizmo

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 2,720 posts

Posted 18 November 2013 - 05:54 PM

Have you been paying attention for the last 15 years?

 

If you mean the losing, yeah. The O's are no longer even close to being one of the worst teams in MLB, though. I was just curious if Matt had any kind of personal problem with the O's organization or town.



#7 johnpolitics

johnpolitics

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 6,927 posts

Posted 18 November 2013 - 06:05 PM

If you go beyond 5 years your crazy, look at Joe Mauer. Old catchers die and go to first base. I like Brian McCann but the Braves can't pay him what he wants and should not.



#8 Far from home

Far from home

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 15,744 posts

Posted 19 November 2013 - 01:31 AM

What is it about Baltimore that would make him want to leave? It makes me think that PGA still makes many of his players feel like they there is no reason to stay.
Ideological gravy trains lead to poor decisions.
Learn from the last President, and make this next era one of rebuilding what has been torn down.
Instead of being loyal to your party, be loyal to your country and your people.

#9 weird-O

weird-O

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 13,385 posts
  • LocationI'm here from downtown, I'm here from Mitch and Murray.

Posted 19 November 2013 - 07:14 AM

weird-O, I ask this out of curiosity. Was any reason given for Matt wanting to get out of Baltimore that you would feel comfortable with saying?

the person I spoke with said that MW doesn't like the mid-atlantic area. there may have been more to that, but he got a call and it broke up the conversation. I didn't stick around to try to dig any deeper. I don't know if there was anything specific about the O's organization, but this part of the country doesn't seem to appeal to him. he's from the S. Carolina, so maybe he isn't comfortable among yankees :P


Edited by weird-O, 19 November 2013 - 07:14 AM.

"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damn lies, and statistics." - Benjamin Disraeli

#10 Gizmo

Gizmo

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 2,720 posts

Posted 19 November 2013 - 07:54 AM

the person I spoke with said that MW doesn't like the mid-atlantic area. there may have been more to that, but he got a call and it broke up the conversation. I didn't stick around to try to dig any deeper. I don't know if there was anything specific about the O's organization, but this part of the country doesn't seem to appeal to him. he's from the S. Carolina, so maybe he isn't comfortable among yankees :P

 

Thanks. I thought it might be something like that since I had not heard of any issues or conflicts with anyone in the organization. 



#11 weird-O

weird-O

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 13,385 posts
  • LocationI'm here from downtown, I'm here from Mitch and Murray.

Posted 19 November 2013 - 08:11 AM

Thanks. I thought it might be something like that since I had not heard of any issues or conflicts with anyone in the organization. 

I told a better version of this story last summer. I have to admit, the details are a bit foggy right now. I was at a meeting, and after it ended, I moved over to the bar to catch the score of the game. there were a few people watching it, and I struck up a conversation with this guy. I found out that he worked with the O's in a capacity where he was in direct contact with the players.

 

here's a sad tidbit of info. it was during that series against the D-backs. it was the extra inning game. looking back on it, that sweep pretty much set the tone for the remainder of the season.  


"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damn lies, and statistics." - Benjamin Disraeli

#12 Gizmo

Gizmo

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 2,720 posts

Posted 19 November 2013 - 02:16 PM

I told a better version of this story last summer. I have to admit, the details are a bit foggy right now. I was at a meeting, and after it ended, I moved over to the bar to catch the score of the game. there were a few people watching it, and I struck up a conversation with this guy. I found out that he worked with the O's in a capacity where he was in direct contact with the players.

 

here's a sad tidbit of info. it was during that series against the D-backs. it was the extra inning game. looking back on it, that sweep pretty much set the tone for the remainder of the season.  

 

That series against the D-backs seemed like it summed up the whole season. Just brutal.

 

I still hope we can find a way to make it work with Matt. Unless I am forgetting something we don't have anyone in the organization remotely capable of being a starting MLB catcher, so if we trade him this off-season it had better include a reliable catcher in return. 



#13 weird-O

weird-O

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 13,385 posts
  • LocationI'm here from downtown, I'm here from Mitch and Murray.

Posted 19 November 2013 - 05:30 PM

That series against the D-backs seemed like it summed up the whole season. Just brutal.

 

I still hope we can find a way to make it work with Matt. Unless I am forgetting something we don't have anyone in the organization remotely capable of being a starting MLB catcher, so if we trade him this off-season it had better include a reliable catcher in return. 

so true. there literally isn't anyone. Caleb Joseph is the only person close to MLB caliber. and the only reason I say that is because he's at the highest level of the minors. but he's a 27 yr old catcher who has never been in a MLB game. that tells me he isn't the answer.


"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damn lies, and statistics." - Benjamin Disraeli

#14 escheinersold

escheinersold

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 646 posts

Posted 21 November 2013 - 08:01 AM

the person I spoke with said that MW doesn't like the mid-atlantic area. there may have been more to that, but he got a call and it broke up the conversation. I didn't stick around to try to dig any deeper. I don't know if there was anything specific about the O's organization, but this part of the country doesn't seem to appeal to him. he's from the S. Carolina, so maybe he isn't comfortable among yankees :P

It is not a surprise. The Mid Atlantic humidity will wear down a catcher and pitcher.  I you think about the difference in S California nd the Mid Atlantic weather Humidity is the material difference. So I ask "IF" Matt has wispered his disre for Atlanta how is he going to handle the humidity there? His wife's family is from Atlanta.


Ed So Pa Fan
:P

#15 weird-O

weird-O

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 13,385 posts
  • LocationI'm here from downtown, I'm here from Mitch and Murray.

Posted 21 November 2013 - 08:35 AM

It is not a surprise. The Mid Atlantic humidity will wear down a catcher and pitcher.  I you think about the difference in S California nd the Mid Atlantic weather Humidity is the material difference. So I ask "IF" Matt has wispered his disre for Atlanta how is he going to handle the humidity there? His wife's family is from Atlanta.

it's just as humid in ATL, and much hotter. if he's looking for a more ideal climate, he won't find it down there. and there is no chance that the Braves will give him a long contract, otherwise, they would just keep McCann, who is a fan and clubhouse favorite. also, they have Gattis to fill the hole until Bethancourt is ready in a year or 2.  


"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damn lies, and statistics." - Benjamin Disraeli




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users