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What Does It Mean to Have a 'Right' to Health Care?


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#81 MiddleOfTheRoad

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 04:34 PM

Self-governing people determine for themselves how much they will contribute to and how they will spend the common weal.

Someone much smarter than I pointed out a long time ago that once given access to the common weal, people will inevitably spend more than they contribute. Witness the US budget scene.

The question should not be where lies the right so much as who funds it ?

#82 Dr Johnny Fever

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 04:50 PM

Governments are made up of people
People collectively determine through war or the political process how much government intervention they're willing to tolerate


Exactly

Our natural rights arise from our humanity (god, if you will).

Man, government in your post, can only constrain these rights-not bestow them.

#83 PinkFlamingo

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 05:08 PM

I don't know about health care being a "right."
However, when I see and hear Elijah Cummings big mouth yelling that it is, I'm naturally inclined to disagree.

#84 ms maggie

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 04:40 AM

I could say the same about state supremacy and the notion of slavery.


Yes. But not modern liberalism/progressivism.

#85 SemiAuto

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 09:50 AM

Yes. But not modern liberalism/progressivism.


The article in the OP has to remind the reader that, "They are not slaves." This is in regards to a faux liberal/progressive policy.

#86 ms maggie

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 09:56 AM

The article in the OP has to remind the reader that, "They are not slaves." This is in regards to a faux liberal/progressive policy.


So you're quoting the link you originally posted to support your POV.

Clever.

This is kinda Trumpian: you read it somewhere so it must be true.

#87 SemiAuto

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 09:59 AM

So you're quoting the link you originally posted to support your POV.

Clever.

This is kinda Trumpian: you read it somewhere so it must be true.


Go forbid I do that. I could just as easily say your that your comment, "Yes. But not modern liberalism/progressivism." is Trumpian by your own standard.

#88 ms maggie

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 10:00 AM

Go forbid I do that. I could just as easily say your that your comment, "Yes. But not modern liberalism/progressivism." is Trumpian by your own standard.


Nope. That is my own conclusion. Didn't read it somewhere.

#89 SemiAuto

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 10:01 AM

Nope. That is my own conclusion. Didn't read it somewhere.


That doesn't make it right.

If you have to rely on the state to pay for your health care then what does that make you in regards to the state?

Edited by SemiAuto, 21 March 2017 - 10:03 AM.


#90 bmore_ken

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 10:05 AM

The thread that keeps on giving :cool: :cool: :cool: :D :D


Secretary of State Hillary Clinton. It has a nice sound to it

Suggs has signed. I've never been so happy to be wrong

Don't blame me, I voted Bob Barr:cool:

#91 banner1124

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 10:22 AM

I don't know about health care being a "right."
However, when I see and hear Elijah Cummings big mouth yelling that it is, I'm naturally inclined to disagree.

That's such a mature approach :rolleyes:


*****HAIL TO THE REDSKINS*****

#92 banner1124

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 10:23 AM

That doesn't make it right.

If you have to rely on the state to pay for your health care then what does that make you in regards to the state?

Last I checked slaves couldn't pick up and leave of their own free will.  Any of us would certainly have that option should we desire not to have our health care paid for by the state.


*****HAIL TO THE REDSKINS*****

#93 EL-FLIPPO

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 10:25 AM

That doesn't make it right.

If you have to rely on the state to pay for your health care then what does that make you in regards to the state?

 

If you have to rely on the employer to pay for most of your health care then what does that make you in regards to the employer?

 

The very nature of any insurance paradigm is that of "sharing the risk".


Edited by EL-FLIPPO, 21 March 2017 - 10:28 AM.

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neither cast ye your pearls before swine,
lest they trample them under their feet
.â€
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#94 PinkFlamingo

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 10:26 AM

That's such a mature approach :rolleyes:


It's just a gut reaction.
Cummings is always screaming about something.

#95 flyboy56

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 10:31 AM

Universal healthcare is about acknowledging compassion as an integral part of being human.  If government is about the public interest there are few issues of greater public interest than a healthy population.  

 

So you are advocating for the government to penalize folks who smoke and drink alcohol for the betterment of a healthy population? 



#96 SemiAuto

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 10:33 AM

If you have to rely on the employer to pay for most of your health care then what does that make you in regards to the employer?
 
The very nature of any insurance paradigm is that of "sharing the risk".


As the OP article points out, health insurance isn't so much about shared risk as it is about pre-paying for health care. This is messed up.

#97 EL-FLIPPO

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 11:15 AM

As the OP article points out, health insurance isn't so much about shared risk as it is about pre-paying for health care. This is messed up.

 

If health insurance was pure "market-driven" (as the OP article advocates), then "pre-payment" would still exist - in the form of premiums.

 

The OP article's argument is that the premises driving market-driven vs gov't.-sponsored health insurance are mutually exclusive.

 

I think the article is confounded by semantics and euphemisms. F.I.C.A. tax deductions are nothing more than gov't.-sponsored health insurance premiums. The question is then why do we need them?

 

How about because we've already tried the honor system, and it didn't work. Anything can happen to people who want to control their own money and disregard health insurance (or who can't afford it).

 

Catastrophic illnesses & major accidents are part of the risks of just being alive. When they happen, guess what? We all share the burden anyway by subsidizing unpaid medical bills via higher premiums, co-pays, and out-of-pocket expenses. We all pay for those who chose not to (or who can't afford to) spread the risk - public or private...one way or another.


Edited by EL-FLIPPO, 21 March 2017 - 11:18 AM.

[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

“Give not that which is holy unto the dogs,
neither cast ye your pearls before swine,
lest they trample them under their feet
.â€
~
Matthew 7:6 ~
 


#98 ms maggie

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 11:47 AM

That doesn't make it right.

If you have to rely on the state to pay for your health care then what does that make you in regards to the state?


The same as it makes me for having the state pay for infrastructure, military, CDC etc. etc.

You're not getting of this, are you?

#99 bmore_ken

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 11:49 AM

The same as it makes me for having the state pay for infrastructure, military, CDC etc. etc.

You're not getting of this, are you?


:D :D :D
Secretary of State Hillary Clinton. It has a nice sound to it

Suggs has signed. I've never been so happy to be wrong

Don't blame me, I voted Bob Barr:cool:

#100 ms maggie

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 11:51 AM

As the OP article points out, health insurance isn't so much about shared risk as it is about pre-paying for health care. This is messed up.


Insurance is by definition pre-paying. It guarantees coverage of losses (of property, life, health) in the FUTURE.




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