gonzoliberal

Is showing Elizabeth Warren in a 'Native American' headress racist?

359 posts in this topic

5 minutes ago, FatBoy said:

I wouldn't say that. There is an on going investigation with evidence linked to the Russian collusion charged.

That is much different from you making up things about Warren. That's a clever dodge though. 

What evidence?  Every time I say there's a lack of evidence, I'm asked if I have access to classified information.  You asked me why I thought Warren made her claim.  I told you why but apparently that's not good enough.

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28 minutes ago, Rael said:

Isn't showing someone portrayed as gay who is not gay even more of a slur than someone who claims to be Native American as Native American? To my mind it is more of a slur to call someone gay who isn't as it implies that gayness is bad or inferior. 

Gay, or just best buds?

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1 hour ago, veritas said:

She did it to curry favor among those who tout their connection to one or another of the left's designated victim groups.  That's all it's about.

I don't believe she ever put out there as public information. If that is the case, it's just your own uniformed, biased opinion.

Unlike Rubio, and his claim that he was a refugee., and who, I can't help but notice, gets a pass.

Edited by hst2

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1 minute ago, hst2 said:

A specific Indian.

A specific Indian can be identified by a photo of Warren in a headdress?  That's what the thread was about.  As for Trump, you would have made the same charge whether he used Pocahontas or any other name.  

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1 minute ago, hst2 said:

Gay, or just best buds?

Yea, because most men ride tandem horse rides bare-chested with their best buds. Please, at least argue your points honestly. 

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1 minute ago, veritas said:

A specific Indian can be identified by a photo of Warren in a headdress?  That's what the thread was about.  As for Trump, you would have made the same charge whether he used Pocahontas or any other name.  

The association with Pocahontas has been clear.

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Just now, hst2 said:

I don't believe she ever put out there as public information.

Unlike Rubio, and his claim that he was a refugee., and who, I can't help but notice, gets a pass.

No, Rubio shouldn't say he's a refugee if he isn't one.  Of course, I wouldn't put this up there with Blumenthal's claim that he served in Vietnam when he did no such thing.  Yet, the Dems didn't seem to care about that.

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1 hour ago, veritas said:

Nobody is suggesting they could find out what tribe her ancestors supposedly belonged to.  However, if her test were to indicate 100% European ancestry, then the odds that she's Native American would seem highly remote.

But the tests wouldn't do that to any reliable degree of accuracy.  Hey I fell for it too when I saw those Ancestry ads but my husband (who works in genetics) explained to me it was pretty much poppycock. There is no gene for European or for native Americans.  There are clusters of DNA "bits" that are common to groups but that is far from definitive.  And the bigger problem is the lack of DNA from "ancestors". You apparently need a whole bunch of samples to start identifying clusters, and there aren't a whole lot of current native Americans (or Europeans for that matter) that have DNA that hasn't been intermixed with other ethnic groups.  

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4 minutes ago, veritas said:

What evidence?  Every time I say there's a lack of evidence, I'm asked if I have access to classified information.  You asked me why I thought Warren made her claim.  I told you why but apparently that's not good enough.

The reason your explanation isn't good enough is it is pure speculation or your part designed to disparage her because she's a 'lib'. Just be honest for once. 

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1 minute ago, Rael said:

Yea, because most men ride tandem horse rides bare-chested with their best buds. Please, at least argue your points honestly. 

 I have, with regard to the difference between the meanings of the two images. The one with Putin and Trump makes fun of Trump, not for being gay, but for his appreciation of the dictator - and it pokes run of the homophobia that runs rampant through many of the testosterone-fueled supporters of the testoster-fueled demagogue. The picture of Warren suports the degrading use of Pocahontas as a disparaging moniker for her.

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Just now, FatBoy said:

The reason your explanation isn't good enough is it is pure speculation or your part designed to disparage her because she's a 'lib'. Just be honest for once. 

Of course it's speculation.  I already said that.  I'm not sure how much plainer I can make it.

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7 minutes ago, veritas said:

No, Rubio shouldn't say he's a refugee if he isn't one.  Of course, I wouldn't put this up there with Blumenthal's claim that he served in Vietnam when he did no such thing.  Yet, the Dems didn't seem to care about that.

The Rubio and Warren claims are identical. Both made claims based on information they were told. Warren is vilified for it, Rubio was never criticized for it. Although he had a much more self-serving motive for his claim.

The other claim is different. 

Edited by hst2

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2 minutes ago, hst2 said:

 I have, with regard to the difference between the meanings of the two images. The one with Putin and Trump makes fun of Trump, not for being gay, but for his appreciation of the dictator - and it pokes run of the homophobia that runs rampant through many of the testosterone-fueled supporters of the testoster-fueled demagogue. The picture of Warren suports the degrading use of Pocahontas as a disparaging moniker for her.

Ok, so, you now agree, in contrast with your other point, that the image is meant to invoke some level of homosexuality in its content. Which means we can lay to rest your "best buds" argument. 

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1 minute ago, hst2 said:

The Rubio and Warren claims are identical, the other example is not.

They're not identical.   If Rubio were claiming to be Cuban and only had a .003% likelihood, then they'd be identical.

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12 minutes ago, hst2 said:

Gay, or just best buds?

Friends with benefits*?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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6 minutes ago, veritas said:

Of course it's speculation.  I already said that.  I'm not sure how much plainer I can make it.

It's such a baseless claim that serves to do nothing but reveal your bias.  But with the birth of the righ's alt-universe, baseless, biased opinion is increasingly accepted as fact. And I have no doubt you think it is a fact, when it's really just a smear.

The fact is, it really shouldn't matter. It's unimportant. 

Edited by hst2

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How do any of you right wingers know for a fact that Warren is lying?  You don't but you keep insisting that she is.   Why?   I would really like an answer and no just that she should have a DNA test to prove her claim because that isn't an answer as to why you insist she is lying.

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4 minutes ago, veritas said:

They're not identical.   If Rubio were claiming to be Cuban and only had a .003% likelihood, then they'd be identical.

I have explained how they are similar.  It doesn't suit your bias, so you ignore it.

I read that the head of the Cherokee Nation is. 003%.

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14 minutes ago, Rael said:

Yea, because most men ride tandem horse rides bare-chested with their best buds. Please, at least argue your points honestly. 

 

4 minutes ago, Rael said:

Ok, so, you now agree, in contrast with your other point, that the image is meant to invoke some level of homosexuality in its content. Which means we can lay to rest your "best buds" argument. 

At best, they are intentionally portraying them as Two-Spirit Native Americans.  That would make them even more complicit in using homosexuality and Native American imagery in a bigoted and racist way if they believe their own explanations that they try to project onto others. 

EPIC FAIL on their part.

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1 minute ago, mrsmlh said:

How do any of you right wingers know for a fact that Warren is lying?  You don't but you keep insisting that she is.   Why?   I would really like an answer and no just that she should have a DNA test to prove her claim because that isn't an answer as to why you insist she is lying.

She is a strong, older, independent woman and they hate her for it. I did a thread recently about her opposition to monopoly capital and they never addressed the issue once, they criticized her.

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6 minutes ago, mrsmlh said:

How do any of you right wingers know for a fact that Warren is lying?  You don't but you keep insisting that she is.   Why?   I would really like an answer and no just that she should have a DNA test to prove her claim because that isn't an answer as to why you insist she is lying.

DING!!!!!!!

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3 minutes ago, mrsmlh said:

How do any of you right wingers know for a fact that Warren is lying?  You don't but you keep insisting that she is.   Why?   I would really like an answer and no just that she should have a DNA test to prove her claim because that isn't an answer as to why you insist she is lying.

I'll make it very easy for you to understand by asking you to compare and contrast hst2's expressed opinions here with those he made about the biracial winner of the college Miss Black pageant not being black enough to win.  That student had a black parent.

Now just look at the claims of Warren and compare. 

 

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12 minutes ago, Rael said:

Ok, so, you now agree, in contrast with your other point, that the image is meant to invoke some level of homosexuality in its content. Which means we can lay to rest your "best buds" argument. 

It portrays two men, regardless of their sexual orientation, of being very physically close. One is free to make or not make the association that they are gay, or just two authoritarians who are hung up onntheir manliness.

If you think it is a slap at homosexuality, you are free to do so, although the timing of such a revelation seems a mite convenient.

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4 minutes ago, Ode2Joy said:

I'll make it very easy for you to understand by asking you to compare and contrast hst2's expressed opinions here with those he made about the biracial winner of the college Miss Black pageant not being black enough to win.  That student had a black parent.

Now just look at the claims of Warren and compare. 

 

I didn't express my own opinion in that matter. I referred to what people said in the article.

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6 minutes ago, hst2 said:

If you think it is a slap at homosexuality, you are free to do so, although the timing of such a revelation seems a mite convenient.

I think both images are bigoted. You, on the other hand, can only see bigotry from your opponents. You are incapable of seeing bigotry when it comes from the left. So, who is being convenient in their myopia again? 

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