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volperdinger

Latest Ballistic Missile Test by North Korea

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By most  accounts, a military solution has been ruled out. The U.N. Security Council, (including China,), has voted for sanctions on more than one occasion. It's obvious by now, that China has little interest in reigning in their pit bull. 

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-09-14/north-korea-threatens-to-use-nuclear-weapon-to-sink-japan

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/sep/14/north-korean-launches-unidentified-missile

Edited by volperdinger

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Huh, and here just a few weeks ago you folks were dancing a jig and gloating your hero Trump had the problem licked.

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North Korea Has Fired A Missile Over Japan Into The Pacific Ocean

The missile prompted Japan to issue an emergency alert for its citizens, warning people to take cover in buildings or underground. The projectile later fell in the Pacific.

https://www.buzzfeed.com/jimdalrympleii/north-korea-has-reportedly-fired-a-missile-over-japan?utm_term=.xx0GBpLek#.meO528amL

A day before the launch, a North Korean state agency threatened Japan, saying it "should be sunken into the sea by the nuclear bomb of Juche," Reuters reported. The agency also said the US should be reduced to "ashes and darkness."

The threats followed new sanctions unanimously adopted by the UN Security Council on Monday. The sanctions ban North Korean textile exports.

Last week, the US Geological Survey recorded a 6.3 magnitude earthquake at a depth of 0.0 kilometers in North Korea, a strong indicator the event was a nuclear test conducted by Kim Jong Un's military.

 

I don't know why someone doesn't take that crazy man out.

Edited by Sprightly

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2 minutes ago, Sprightly said:

...I don't know why someone doesn't take that crazy man out.

Don't worry. Trump said before that an "armada was on the way" and that there would be "fire and fury like the world has never seen." 

So proud to have a president that keeps the bull-zhit flowing.

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25 minutes ago, Calamari said:

Huh, and here just a few weeks ago you folks were dancing a jig and gloating your hero Trump had the problem licked.

That never happened.  Please provide a link where anyone reported the problem was solved.  You are simply being dishonest (to be polite.)

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19 minutes ago, dogstarman said:

Don't worry. Trump said before that an "armada was on the way" and that there would be "fire and fury like the world has never seen." 

So proud to have a president that keeps the bull-zhit flowing.

Your ridicule makes me think you are a war mongering nut.  

Maybe instead of throwing rocks (with a really weak arm) you should share what you think should be done?  

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8 hours ago, jdsample said:

Your ridicule makes me think you are a war mongering nut.  

Maybe instead of throwing rocks (with a really weak arm) you should share what you think should be done?  

I already did. I said there will be no military action at all: nothing to be gained by it, too much to lose. Regardless of the bluster from the oval office and the ridiculous rhetoric coming from North Korea, nothing will happen.

North Korea will develop their nukes on ICBM's and the border will stay where it is. 

Trump's blow-hard meaningless rhetoric denigrates the image of the USA. He deserves all the ridicule coming at him. It's a pity that your steadfast political loyalty keeps you from seeing that.

 

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9 hours ago, Sprightly said:

North Korea Has Fired A Missile Over Japan Into The Pacific Ocean

The missile prompted Japan to issue an emergency alert for its citizens, warning people to take cover in buildings or underground. The projectile later fell in the Pacific.

https://www.buzzfeed.com/jimdalrympleii/north-korea-has-reportedly-fired-a-missile-over-japan?utm_term=.xx0GBpLek#.meO528amL

A day before the launch, a North Korean state agency threatened Japan, saying it "should be sunken into the sea by the nuclear bomb of Juche," Reuters reported. The agency also said the US should be reduced to "ashes and darkness."

The threats followed new sanctions unanimously adopted by the UN Security Council on Monday. The sanctions ban North Korean textile exports.

Last week, the US Geological Survey recorded a 6.3 magnitude earthquake at a depth of 0.0 kilometers in North Korea, a strong indicator the event was a nuclear test conducted by Kim Jong Un's military.

 

I don't know why someone doesn't take that crazy man out.

Yes, the new assessment for the H-bomb detonated 03SEP2017 is now 250 Kilotons.

 

Here is the damage map for a 1km altitude airburst centered over Johns Hopkins

https://nuclearsecrecy.com/nukemap/?&kt=250&lat=39.3302333&lng=-76.619525&hob_opt=2&hob_psi=5&hob_ft=3281&zm=12

 

The largest yellow circle is 100% probability of 3rd degree burns on any exposed person

 

Edited by karlydee2

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20 minutes ago, dogstarman said:

I already did. I said there will be no military action at all: nothing to be gained by it, too much to lose. Regardless of the bluster from the oval office and the ridiculous rhetoric coming from North Korea, nothing will happen.

North Korea will develop their nukes on ICBM's and the border will stay where it is. 

Trump's blow-hard meaningless rhetoric denigrates the image of the USA. He deserves all the ridicule coming at him. It's a pity that your steadfast political loyalty keeps you from seeing that.

 

+1

/thread

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22 minutes ago, dogstarman said:

I already did. I said there will be no military action at all: nothing to be gained by it, too much to lose. Regardless of the bluster from the oval office and the ridiculous rhetoric coming from North Korea, nothing will happen.

North Korea will develop their nukes on ICBM's and the border will stay where it is. 

Trump's blow-hard meaningless rhetoric denigrates the image of the USA. He deserves all the ridicule coming at him. It's a pity that your steadfast political loyalty keeps you from seeing that.

 

I see.  So your advice is to give up and do nothing.  Maybe we should take out an ad in the Pyong Yang Times telling the NOKOs they can do anything they like with Trump's benevolent blessing?  We could offer to help transport their products to Iran and Palestine?  

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4 minutes ago, jdsample said:

I see.  So your advice is to give up and do nothing.  Maybe we should take out an ad in the Pyong Yang Times telling the NOKOs they can do anything they like with Trump's benevolent blessing?  We could offer to help transport their products to Iran and Palestine?  

I ran doesn't need NK's stuff.

They are doing pretty well on their own.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fateh-110

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They might get there.  But who doesn't benefit from a collaborative relationship?  You think Iran would turn down Chinese technology served up with a bow for a few tankers of oil?  I can't see Iran passing up the Black Friday Nuclear Sale at the Pyong Yang Best Buy.  The mullahs are not likely to say, "no, no, we got this."  

Although it is interesting to note that that is exactly the attitude that caused Islamic culture to peak, and then stagnate while the rest of the world rocketed forward.  They had the widespread belief that the Koran was the last word in human knowledge and thus had nothing to learn from other cultures and no reason to inquire into anything themselves.  So the leaders in math & science and literature quickly found themselves mired into the third world.  A constant stream of European scholar travelled the Middle East translating everything they could lay their hands on into European languages.  Arabs almost never visited the outside world and the one book they saw fit to translate to Arabic was a French manual on how to treat syphilis.  But things like clocks and printing presses were sought out and destroyed.  

Edited by jdsample

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1 minute ago, jdsample said:

They might get there.  But who doesn't benefit from a collaborative relationship?  You think Iran would turn down Chinese technology served up for a few tankers of oil?  I can't see Iran not going to the Black Friday Nuclear Sale in Pyong Yang.  The mullahs are not likely to say, "no, no, we got this."  

I don't see Kim giving up any of his nuclear tech, warheads or stockpile. Zip zero nada.

I do however, think Japan likely has a nuclear capability, https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/fukushima-anniversary/japan-has-nuclear-bomb-basement-china-isnt-happy-n48976

They have a highly capable space launch industry -- which gives them the means to deliver - very precisely.

I also believe that depending on circumstance, Japan would use a first strike regardless of the devastation it would cause to Seoul.

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7 minutes ago, karlydee2 said:

I don't see Kim giving up any of his nuclear tech, warheads or stockpile. Zip zero nada.

I do however, think Japan likely has a nuclear capability, https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/fukushima-anniversary/japan-has-nuclear-bomb-basement-china-isnt-happy-n48976

They have a highly capable space launch industry -- which gives them the means to deliver - very precisely.

I also believe that depending on circumstance, Japan would use a first strike regardless of the devastation it would cause to Seoul.

Pretty long leap here karlydee2.  You take an article highlighting a speculative "bomb in the basement " theory and in thee sentences, move to a Japanese first strike.

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2 minutes ago, MiddleOfTheRoad said:

Pretty long leap here karlydee2.  You take an article highlighting a speculative "bomb in the basement " theory and in thee sentences, move to a Japanese first strike.

They have a history of first strike.

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I HOPE to God you are right about the first point, but I am skeptical.  If by that you mean they wouldn't sell the finished products.  But if by giving up you mean abandoning, I think you are right.  

And I agree with your other points.  There is a certain cultural ruthlessness under a gentile veneer that did not die on the deck of the Missouri.  
 

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1 minute ago, jdsample said:

I HOPE to God you are right about the first point, but I am skeptical.  If by that you mean they wouldn't sell the finished products.  But if by giving up you mean abandoning, I think you are right.  

And I agree with your other points.  There is a certain cultural ruthlessness under a gentile veneer that did not die on the deck of the Missouri.  
 

And there is an entire philosophy regarding how one legitimizes a first strike as being purely defensive in nature

go no sen, sen no sen, sensen, no sen

http://www.aiki-shuren-dojo.com/pdf/Go no sen.pdf

sen no sen mean to literally identify intent and attack to stop the imminent attack

 

sen sen no sen -- is even more ruthless -- it means to instigate or entice an opponent into a clear attacking mode and using that as an excuse for a defensive first strike.

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4 minutes ago, karlydee2 said:

And there is an entire philosophy regarding how one legitimizes a first strike as being purely defensive in nature

go no sen, sen no sen, sensen, no sen

http://www.aiki-shuren-dojo.com/pdf/Go no sen.pdf

sen no sen mean to literally identify intent and attack to stop the imminent attack

 

sen sen no sen -- is even more ruthless -- it means to instigate or entice an opponent into a clear attacking mode and using that as an excuse for a defensive first strike.

Interesting.  I know if I were 20-30 years older, I sure would have preferred the European front, to the Pacific front.  The Germans were ruthless, but the Japanese were downright frightening.  

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8 minutes ago, karlydee2 said:

They have a history of first strike.

As does France, UK, Spain, Mexico, Germany, China, Russia, US...

And a preemptive strike is legal and legitimate in specific cases.

 

 

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If only we could take control of the guidance system on the missile and send it over China...

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44 minutes ago, flyboy56 said:

If only we could take control of the guidance system on the missile and send it over China...

LOL.  That might get someone's attention. ;)

 

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1 hour ago, jdsample said:

I see.  So your advice is to give up and do nothing....

Not really. I am actually in favor of the current activities involving sanctions. It won't stop the icbm development but anything that weakens NK and makes them more susceptible to an eventual internal revolt is, within limits, probably a good idea.

But for the sake of argument, YES, ACTUALLY "doing nothing" is better than doing nothing after making a bunch of stupid empty threats like a foolhardy dictator wannabe.

Edited by dogstarman

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2 minutes ago, dogstarman said:

Not really. I am actually in favor of the current activities involving sanctions. It won't stop the icbm development but anything that weakens NK and makes them more susceptible to internal revolt is, within limits, probably a good idea.

But for the sake of argument, YES, ACTUALLY "doing nothing" is better than doing nothing after making a bunch of stupid empty threats like a foolhardy dictator wannabe.

I don't think anyone believes the threats are empty.  Yes, it is a last resort, but Libya gave up nukes on the same threat.  The world saw the US blow through Afghanistan and Iraq in succession like a bullet through a wet sheet of charmin'.  Kim knows that crossing the line will get him the same fate.  The only ace he holds is the ability to do real damage to Seoul before his regime gets rolled up and tossed in the dustbin of history.  

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3 minutes ago, jdsample said:

I don't think anyone believes the threats are empty.  Yes, it is a last resort, but Libya gave up nukes on the same threat.  The world saw the US blow through Afghanistan and Iraq in succession like a bullet through a wet sheet of charmin'.  Kim knows that crossing the line will get him the same fate.  The only ace he holds is the ability to do real damage to Seoul before his regime gets rolled up and tossed in the dustbin of history.  

And the way that turned out for Libya made it an absolute certainty that NK is NOT going to give up theirs

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19 minutes ago, jdsample said:

I don't think anyone believes the threats are empty.  ... The world saw the US blow through Afghanistan and Iraq in succession like a bullet through a wet sheet of charmin'.  ...

Really? You are saying with a straight face that when Trump said an "Armada is on the way" it wasn't an empty threat? I mean it wasn't an Armada, it was an aircraft carrier and, oh yeah, much to the surprise of the ship's captain it wasn't even heading to NK (https://www.newyorker.com/news/amy-davidson/donald-trump-north-korea-and-the-case-of-the-phantom-armada). If the context were different one could make a case that that was figurative language... but not here. He just riffed like a real estate guy in a boiler room operation. Except it wasn't a boiler room and it wasn't a student of Trump U he was trying to rip off, it was Xi Jinping. So embarrassing to have the leader of the Free world so utterly outclassed.

As for Afghanistan and Iraq, sorry to break it to you but we are still facing significant problems there THIRTEEN YEARS after Dubya gave a speech in front of a banner declaring "Mission Accomplished". That's a bit tougher than "wet toilet paper" , I think.

Edited by dogstarman

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