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johnpolitics

Phillies want Manny.

49 posts in this topic

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2017/12/trade-chatter-machado-phils-yanks-bucs-cole-ellsbury-tigers-brewers.html

Should the Orioles decide to trade superstar third baseman Manny Machado prior to 2018, his contract year, they could find a taker in Philadelphia. The Phillies are among “the more interested parties” in Machado, Roch Kubatko of MASNsports.comreports. The Orioles have studied the Phillies’ farm system in the event of a deal, and they now “covet” right-hander Sixto Sanchez (Baseball America’s 61st-best prospect), per Kubatko. Second base prospect Scott Kingery and major league shortstop Freddy Galvis could also be involved in a potential trade, Kubatko writes. But a swap would require a 72-hour window for the Phillies to extend the 25-year-old Machado, according to Kubatko, and hammering out an agreement could be a tall order given that he’s so close to hitting the open market.

 

Well for O's fans it would be a short drive to see him...

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43 minutes ago, bmore_ken said:

I've made the decision if they don't resign Manny, I'm done with them as a team.

I’d only stick around to watch another team come in and beat them 

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Manny's heading for a mega deal. A legit huge mega deal. Not Chris Davis huge deal, but next tier mega deal.

I don't think there's a snowball's chance in he11 that the Orioles will be the team that gives it to him. I'll be more ticked off though if they let him walk for nothing more than a comp pick. 

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3 hours ago, bmore_ken said:

I've made the decision if they don't resign Manny, I'm done with them as a team.

I think it'd be worse if they simply did nothing and let him walk after next year. 

Re-signing Manny doesn't make the Orioles better, just way more expensive.

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2 hours ago, Mr. Buzzcut said:

Phillies expecting to contend in 2018?

They have a ton of cash to spend in free agency. 

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7 hours ago, mdrunning said:

I think it'd be worse if they simply did nothing and let him walk after next year. 

Re-signing Manny doesn't make the Orioles better, just way more expensive.

And that's the problem with what baseball has become.  Only the giant payroll teams can keep their superstars.

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12 hours ago, johnpolitics said:

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2017/12/trade-chatter-machado-phils-yanks-bucs-cole-ellsbury-tigers-brewers.html

Should the Orioles decide to trade superstar third baseman Manny Machado prior to 2018, his contract year, they could find a taker in Philadelphia. The Phillies are among “the more interested parties” in Machado, Roch Kubatko of MASNsports.comreports. The Orioles have studied the Phillies’ farm system in the event of a deal, and they now “covet” right-hander Sixto Sanchez (Baseball America’s 61st-best prospect), per Kubatko. Second base prospect Scott Kingery and major league shortstop Freddy Galvis could also be involved in a potential trade, Kubatko writes. But a swap would require a 72-hour window for the Phillies to extend the 25-year-old Machado, according to Kubatko, and hammering out an agreement could be a tall order given that he’s so close to hitting the open market.

 

Well for O's fans it would be a short drive to see him...

Drive up the market and send him on his way. They can garner a better package than one where the best player is MLB's 61st best prospect, though. 

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8 hours ago, mdrunning said:

I think it'd be worse if they simply did nothing and let him walk after next year. 

Re-signing Manny doesn't make the Orioles better, just way more expensive.

At some point if you want to keep me as a fan, you have to show me you give a damn. There's no reason they can't sign him and make other improvements. I get your point, but trading for a few prospects doesn't necessarily make them better either.

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18 minutes ago, EnochRoot said:

Drive up the market and send him on his way. They can garner a better package than one where the best player is MLB's 61st best prospect, though. 

Without an extension in place, you're not getting that king's ransom some of you guys are expecting. No one is gutting their system for one season of Manny.

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Just now, bmore_ken said:

Without an extension in place, you're not getting that king's ransom some of you guys are expecting. No one is gutting their system for one season of Manny.

I get what you're saying, but there are better offers out there to be had than that...And they can get particularly juicy once the O's allow for a sit down with Machado about his amenability to potentially re-sign with that particular team, thus bypassing FA. 

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5 minutes ago, bmore_ken said:

Without an extension in place, you're not getting that king's ransom some of you guys are expecting. No one is gutting their system for one season of Manny.

Exactly.  If anyone trades for him, I'm sure they're going to stipulate that they have to be able to sign him to an extension as part of the deal.  Why do that now and give up players and sign him, when you can wait a year and just sign him, and keep your prospects, too?

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2 minutes ago, EnochRoot said:

I get what you're saying, but there are better offers out there to be had than that...And they can get particularly juicy once the O's allow for a sit down with Machado about his amenability to potentially re-sign with that particular team, thus bypassing FA. 

That's sort of what I just said. And it's not potentially resign with the new team. A deal will have to be in place. 

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3 minutes ago, bmore_ken said:

At some point if you want to keep me as a fan, you have to show me you give a damn. There's no reason they can't sign him and make other improvements. I get your point, but trading for a few prospects doesn't necessarily make them better either.

Once again that idiotic Davis contract is handcuffing the O's. But Buck wanted his neighbor, and Buck always gets his way. Remove that Davis contract, and the other money that's come off the books, as well as the money that's coming off the books after the 2018 season, and keeping Manny wouldn't be any problem at all.

I really don't expect to pay any attention to this team. Like Bleeding man, I'll go to some random games, buying $60 face value seats for $15. But I'm not investing any emotion. I'm pretty much done with the O's.    

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1 minute ago, weird-O said:

Once again that idiotic Davis contract is handcuffing the O's. But Buck wanted his neighbor, and Buck always gets his way. Remove that Davis contract, and the other money that's come off the books, as well as the money that's coming off the books after the 2018 season, and keeping Manny wouldn't be any problem at all.

I really don't expect to pay any attention to this team. Like Bleeding man, I'll go to some random games, buying $60 face value seats for $15. But I'm not investing any emotion. I'm pretty much done with the O's.    

Yep you nailed it.  Trumbo would of been a perfectly fine replacement at first base and he was already in the fold when Davis was a FA.  Yes, idiotic.  

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3 minutes ago, weird-O said:

Once again that idiotic Davis contract is handcuffing the O's. But Buck wanted his neighbor, and Buck always gets his way. Remove that Davis contract, and the other money that's come off the books, as well as the money that's coming off the books after the 2018 season, and keeping Manny wouldn't be any problem at all.

I really don't expect to pay any attention to this team. Like Bleeding man, I'll go to some random games, buying $60 face value seats for $15. But I'm not investing any emotion. I'm pretty much done with the O's.    

From what I saw of Davis's deal, a lot of the money is deferred. Unless I read the announcement wrong last year. I'll admit I'm more versed in NFL finances than MLB, but I don't see Davis's contract as an impediment to signing Manny. Again unless I have my facts wrong about the Davis contract, which is definitely possible. And yes we all agree that contract might be the worst in O's history.

Edited by bmore_ken

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6 minutes ago, bmore_ken said:

That's sort of what I just said. And it's not potentially resign with the new team. A deal will have to be in place. 

You know who the team would be then, who are itching to overpay on a guy to place into the middle of their lineup to make their blues go away?

Boston.

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4 minutes ago, Thirteen said:

Exactly.  If anyone trades for him, I'm sure they're going to stipulate that they have to be able to sign him to an extension as part of the deal.  Why do that now and give up players and sign him, when you can wait a year and just sign him, and keep your prospects, too?

There's one reason that comes to mind, it's from the Cardinals playbook. They traded for Macguire, just before he became a FA. Their reasoning was, if we get a chance to show him the Cardinals experience, he'll want to stay. Without that experience, we'll be just another team making him an offer. Granted, it's not an apples to apples comparison.

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5 minutes ago, bmore_ken said:

From what I saw of Davis's deal, a lot of the money is deferred. Unless I read the announcement wrong last year. I'll admit I'm more versed in NFL finances than MLB, but I don't see Davis's contract as an impediment to signing Manny. Again unless I have my facts wrong about the Davis contract, which is definitely possible. And yes we all agree that contract might be the worst in O's history.

You're correct, he's earning $17M/yr, $42M is deferred from 2023-2037. But that's still a lot of money each year. Unnecessarily spent money at that.

All that aside, at the basic level, you're right, there's no reason the O's can't sign Manny to a market value contract, even with the other money that's committed .  

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12 minutes ago, EnochRoot said:

You know who the team would be then, who are itching to overpay on a guy to place into the middle of their lineup to make their blues go away?

Boston.

Although Pete is unlikely to trade Manny within the division, Boston always seems to have blue chip prospects to burn.

The curious thing about this Manny situation is this, he has never shown any hints about where he'd like to go to. He grew up a Marlins fan, and he loves his hometown. But they aren't moving Stanton, just to replace him with an equal or greater contract. Everyone always assumes NY, but this isn't George's Yankees. Personally, I no longer default to the NY assumption. 

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11 hours ago, mdrunning said:

They have a ton of cash to spend in free agency. 

I see, but I assume then that they'd want to sign him to an extension and it's hard to see why he'd do that for a 66 win team.

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12 minutes ago, Mr. Buzzcut said:

I see, but I assume then that they'd want to sign him to an extension and it's hard to see why he'd do that for a 66 win team.

I don't see why they think they'd be a place Manny would want to go to. Maybe their future looks bright, but Philly is a franchise with long stretches of being very forgettable.

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LOOKS LIKE THE O'S WANT TO TRADE MANNY!

While it’s been reported that the Orioles are at least willing to listen to offers on Manny Machado, Ken Rosenthal of The Athletic takes things a step further, reporting that the O’s have asked interested parties to make them offers for the star infielder (subscription required and highly recommended). The term “infielder” is of particular note, as Rosenthal also writes that Machado’s desire is to return to shortstop in 2018 whether he’s in Baltimore or with a new club.

Machado, 25, has long stood out as an on-paper trade candidate given his proximity to free agency and the Orioles’ lack of starting pitching. The O’s, who have been looking to add as many as three starters to their rotation this winter, will be hard-pressed to contend for an AL East title in 2018 (even more so in the wake of the Yankees’ acquisition of Giancarlo Stanton). With Machado set to hit the open market next winter in position to land a record-setting contract — assuming a healthy year, anything south of Stanton’s $325MM guarantee would seem to be a nonstarter — it’s difficult to envision him remaining in Baltimore. For the time being, MLBTR contributor Matt Swartz projects a $17.3MM salary for Machado next year after his final trip through the arbitration process.

The Orioles, per Rosenthal, are aiming to acquire two controllable young starters in any trade for Machado. That’s a lofty ask for a lot of teams, but a win-now club with an ample supply of touted but unproven pitching could look at that as an acceptable price to pay for a player that has been worth better than five wins per season, on average, over the past half decade (despite missing 80 games due to injury in 2014). Notably, Rosenthal adds that owner Peter Angelos does not want to trade with the division-rival Yankees.

Machado didn’t have his best season in 2017, as he got off to a shockingly pedestrian start to the year. Through the season’s first three months, Machado was batting just .216/.289/.423 with an elevated (by his standards) 20.6 percent strikeout rate. Over the final three months, though, the Machado of old resurfaced, as he mashed at a .295/.329/.513 pace with a vastly improved 13.1 percent punchout rate.

Machado has two Gold Gloves and a Platinum Glove to his name at third base and has long graded out as an elite defender there, but there’s little doubt that he could still handle shortstop at an above-average level as well. He logged nearly 400 innings there in 2016, for instance, and drew generally positive marks from Ultimate Zone Rating (+1.9) and Defensive Runs Saved (+3).

From a broader perspective, Machado is one of several players entering his final year of team control in Baltimore. Zach Britton, Adam Jones and Brad Brach are all free agents following the 2018 season, while Jonathan Schoop is controlled for just one year beyond that. Depending on how aggressively the O’s are willing to sell off parts, they could quickly restock their farm with an ample supply of talent by marketing more than one of their soon-to-be free agents, though doing so would also mean largely punting on the 2018 campaign at the very least.

 

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2 hours ago, weird-O said:

Although Pete is unlikely to trade Manny within the division, Boston always seems to have blue chip prospects to burn.

The curious thing about this Manny situation is this, he has never shown any hints about where he'd like to go to. He grew up a Marlins fan, and he loves his hometown. But they aren't moving Stanton, just to replace him with an equal or greater contract. Everyone always assumes NY, but this isn't George's Yankees. Personally, I no longer default to the NY assumption. 

Sure looks like some landing spots for Manny are drying up.  Yanks picked 265mil on the Stanton deal and Judge/Sanches will need paid down the road.  Dodgers have Turner/Seager and Marlins look like they are on the cheap.  Unless the Marlins are actually clearing the decks for Manny.  Manny at short in Miami would be a better face of franchise for Jeter than Stanton.  Boston would be in play as well.

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