Calamari

WATCH: Memphis takes bold legal action to circumvent Tennessee state rule and remove Confederate statues

148 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

1 hour ago, Smokey 1 said:

You believe every southern soldier was motivated to fight so they could own slaves? 

Do you think every soldier who fought in Iraq wanted to spread democracy? Soldiers do what they're told.

Edited by bmore_ken

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51 minutes ago, Duke of Earl said:

The tyrant Lincoln wanted the South to be permanent subservient colony to pay for the central government and support northern industrialists . . He murdered 750,000 Americans, including women and children, to accomplish his evil goal .

All's well that ends well.

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2 hours ago, Smokey 1 said:

You mean a nation of slavers like the United States of America prior to 1865?

Yes, like that.

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1 hour ago, Duke of Earl said:

The tyrant Lincoln wanted the South to be permanent subservient colony to pay for the central government and support northern industrialists . . He murdered 750,000 Americans, including women and children, to accomplish his evil goal .

This has got to be a troll post. :)

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4 hours ago, Evil Yoda said:

This has got to be a troll post. :)

Yes, obviously. The highest current (revised) estimate for ALL deaths in the Civil War is the 750,000 number. So, unless The Duke is blaming Lincoln for the Union deaths, and by definition excusing the Confederates of causing any deaths, his number is distorted.  

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Posted (edited)

8 hours ago, bmore_ken said:

Do you think every soldier who fought in Iraq wanted to spread democracy? Soldiers do what they're told.

Of course not and yes they followed orders so does that make them the horrible people that yoda claims they were?

Edited by Smokey 1

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3 hours ago, FatBoy said:

Yes, obviously. The highest current (revised) estimate for ALL deaths in the Civil War is the 750,000 number. So, unless The Duke is blaming Lincoln for the Union deaths, and by definition excusing the Confederates of causing any deaths, his number is distorted.  

It was Lincoln's war so all of the deaths can be attributed to him.  

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1 hour ago, Smokey 1 said:

It was Lincoln's war so all of the deaths can be attributed to him.  

in each and every one of these issues, you come down on the side of white supremacy. In each and every one if these scenarios you deny Blacks any recognition of dignity or even humanity.

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5 hours ago, Smokey 1 said:

Of course not and yes they followed orders so does that make them the horrible people that yoda claims they were?

Which of my posts said confederate soldiers were horrible people?

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13 hours ago, Evil Yoda said:

This has got to be a troll post. :)

No he really believes that. 

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Posted (edited)

14 minutes ago, bmore_ken said:

Which of my posts said confederate soldiers were horrible people?

Your didn't, I was arguing with yoda who said they were and you jumped in on his side of the argument.

Edited by Smokey 1

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4 hours ago, hst2 said:

in each and every one of these issues, you come down on the side of white supremacy. In each and every one if these scenarios you deny Blacks any recognition of dignity or even humanity.

Bullcrap, my arguments have nothing to do with white supremacy.  You are lying again.  

What are you talking about in your second sentence?  Sounds like you are angry that I haven't revised history.

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27 minutes ago, Smokey 1 said:

Your didn't, I was arguing with yoda who said they were and you jumped in on his side of the argument.

If that’s what he said, I don’t agree. Confederate soldiers weren’t all horrible people, their leaders were.

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58 minutes ago, bmore_ken said:

If that’s what he said, I don’t agree. Confederate soldiers weren’t all horrible people, their leaders were.

Not all Confederate officers approved of slavery.  General Longstreet was quoted as saying, "they should have freed the slaves and then fired on Sumter".  

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14 minutes ago, Smokey 1 said:

Not all Confederate officers approved of slavery.  General Longstreet was quoted as saying, "they should have freed the slaves and then fired on Sumter".  

I was thinking more of the civilian leaders but good for Longstreet.

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Posted (edited)

5 hours ago, bmore_ken said:

I was thinking more of the civilian leaders but good for Longstreet.

And I agree with Longstreet.  Stonewall Jackson opposed slavery and taught slaves to read English which was against the law at the time.  

I agree with you the most blame goes to the civilian leaders, the military only does what they are ordered to do. 

Edited by Smokey 1

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“Every man should endeavor to understand the meaning of subjugation before it is too late… It means the history of this heroic struggle will be written by the enemy; that our youth will be trained by Northern schoolteachers; will learn from Northern school books their version of the war; will be impressed by the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors, and our maimed veterans as fit objects for derision… It is said slavery is all we are fighting for, and if we give it up we give up all. Even if this were true, which we deny, slavery is not all our enemies are fighting for. It is merely the pretense to establish sectional superiority and a more centralized form of government, and to deprive us of our rights and liberties.”
Maj. General Patrick R. Cleburne, CSA, January 1864

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Posted (edited)

1 hour ago, Duke of Earl said:

“Every man should endeavor to understand the meaning of subjugation before it is too late… It means the history of this heroic struggle will be written by the enemy; that our youth will be trained by Northern schoolteachers; will learn from Northern school books their version of the war; will be impressed by the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors, and our maimed veterans as fit objects for derision… It is said slavery is all we are fighting for, and if we give it up we give up all. Even if this were true, which we deny, slavery is not all our enemies are fighting for. It is merely the pretense to establish sectional superiority and a more centralized form of government, and to deprive us of our rights and liberties.”
Maj. General Patrick R. Cleburne, CSA, January 1864

You lost dude, time to get over it. I'm pretty sure there are books on the war written by southern writers. 

Edited by bmore_ken

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4 hours ago, bmore_ken said:

You lost dude, time to get over it. I'm pretty sure there are books on the war written by southern writers. 

             I'M A GOOD OLD REBEL

 

 

Oh, I'm a good old Rebel, now that's just what I am,

For this "Fair Land of Freedom" I do not give a damn!

I'm glad I fit against it, I only wish we'd won,

And I don't want no pardon for anything I done.

 

I hates the Constitution, this Great Republic, too,

I hates the Freedman's Buro in uniforms of blue,

I hates the nasty eagle with all his brag and fuss,

The lying, thieving Yankees, I hates 'em wuss and wuss!

 

I hates the Yankee nation and everything they do,

I hates the Declaration of Independence, too,

I hates the "Glorious Union" , 'tis dripping with our blood,

I hates their striped banner, I fit it all I could.

 

I followed old Marse Robert for four years, near about,

Got wounded in three places, and starved at P'int Lookout;

I cotched the "roomatism" a'campin' in the snow,

But I killed a chance o' Yankees, and I'd like to kill some mo'.

 

Three hundred thousand Yankees is stiff in Southern dust!

We got three hundred thousand before they conquered us.

They died of Southern fever and Southern steel and shot,

I wish they was three million instead of what we got.

 

I can't take up my musket and fight 'em now no more,

But I ain't a'gonna love 'em, now that is sarten sure;

And I don't want no pardon for what I was and am,

I won't be reconstructed, and I do not care a damn!

 

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8 hours ago, Smokey 1 said:

Your didn't, I was arguing with yoda who said they were and you jumped in on his side of the argument.

I said the Confederacy was horrible, and I said I don't understand why anyone would support a treasonous movement created to maintain a slaver state.

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6 minutes ago, Evil Yoda said:

I said the Confederacy was horrible, and I said I don't understand why anyone would support a treasonous movement created to maintain a slaver state.

Your actual quote was:

Quote

No, but I do believe the worst of the Confederates and their modern day apologists, because they were bad people, deeply morally flawed.

When you say "Confederates" I think the military and that may part of a misunderstanding.  

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1 minute ago, Smokey 1 said:

Your actual quote was:

When you say "Confederates" I think the military and that may part of a misunderstanding.  

It is an ambiguous sentence. I mean the movers and shakers - those who created it, who benefited from it, and such of its army as fought for its ideas (as opposed to those who fought because they were told to - they are not blameless, because they did support a slaver state. But soldiers do take orders.)

Were I Lincoln, I would have hung Jefferson Davis and Robert E. Lee as traitors, and maybe some others. Maybe then we wouldn't be having this discussion.

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