mdrunning

Black Monday Thread

97 posts in this topic

1 minute ago, Guido2 said:

I have been reading all your ensights and view and all are very good. Including consistancy in coaching (team stategy).

I dunno about you all....but lately with the Ravens....I feel like I am watching Moses leading the Jews. Don't really know what is going to happen talent wise or team wise.....but they wander around ....hoping for a miracle. We as fan's hear this that...this is going to be the next (pick hall of fame player) and half the time they are riding the bench.

Very frustrating.

haha, I don't know if I can hang on for another 40yrs of this.. There are some things they get traction on and then it gets your hopes up-- but the same problems remain the same problems.. talk about making another trip around the mountain....

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1 minute ago, mikemor1 said:

I totally agree- I'm not only hoping they draft 2WR's but another TE not like Boyle or Williams.

In my heart I agree they need to draft 2WRs...but as I pointed out from a practical viewpoint ....as I said earlier....Ozzies track record ..well it sucks? So I am leary. Camp and Peimann....Both break all the time....and Perimann....flinches too much.

TE...he has done very well w/ Heap and Pitta. for example.

 

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1 minute ago, mikemor1 said:

I totally agree- I'm not only hoping they draft 2WR's but another TE not like Boyle or Williams.

And maybe if the Ravens had a bona fide tight end, they could learn how to actually defense one in a game. Two of Cincinnati's touchdowns yesterday went to Tyler Kroft who is--yep--a tight end for the Bengals. On the first one, they had him one-on-one with Kamalei Correa, who is simply not a coverage linebacker, and on the second, Kroft was so open he was in the back of the end zone yawning. The Ravens have a knack for making even the most mundane of tight ends look like the second coming of Kellen Winslow.

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1 minute ago, Guido2 said:

In my heart I agree they need to draft 2WRs...but as I pointed out from a practical viewpoint ....as I said earlier....Ozzies track record ..well it sucks? So I am leary. Camp and Peimann....Both break all the time....and Perimann....flinches too much.

TE...he has done very well w/ Heap and Pitta. for example.

 

I know his track record with WR's- and when they drafted Perriman I found myself saying- Who???

He tries to get too cute with the draft, IMHO- look at the Correa debacle-they could have had a WR.

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1 minute ago, mdrunning said:

And maybe if the Ravens had a bona fide tight end, they could learn how to actually defense one in a game. Two of Cincinnati's touchdowns yesterday went to Tyler Kroft who is--yep--a tight end for the Bengals. On the first one, they had him one-on-one with Kamalei Correa, who is simply not a coverage linebacker, and on the second, Kroft was so open he was in the back of the end zone yawning. The Ravens have a knack for making even the most mundane of tight ends look like the second coming of Kellen Winslow.

Correa shouldn't be playing the position of LB- he's another Arthur Brown, also drafted as a #2- is he even still in football?

I agree they need another "real" pass catching TE. Watson has held the fort so to speak, but you can't rely on him going forward.

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Posted (edited)

8 minutes ago, mdrunning said:

And maybe if the Ravens had a bona fide tight end, they could learn how to actually defense one in a game. Two of Cincinnati's touchdowns yesterday went to Tyler Kroft who is--yep--a tight end for the Bengals. On the first one, they had him one-on-one with Kamalei Correa, who is simply not a coverage linebacker, and on the second, Kroft was so open he was in the back of the end zone yawning. The Ravens have a knack for making even the most mundane of tight ends look like the second coming of Kellen Winslow.

Ahhh in case you hadn't noticed but the Ravins do that with all their players per position.

But then.I am beginning to think that the NFL is so watered down that ...well....if you are slightly better....your a superstar. Regardless of team.

Same thing happened and still is with MLB...

Edited by Guido2

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Posted (edited)

11 hours ago, mikemor1 said:

I know his track record with WR's- and when they drafted Perriman I found myself saying- Who???

He tries to get too cute with the draft, IMHO- look at the Correa debacle-they could have had a WR.

I think the problem the Ravens have had, again, is the square-peg, round-hole approach. We've discussed it on here at length regarding the offense and the problems a West Coast offense poses for the players they have, but they seem to do the same thing on the defensive side as well.

When the Ravens took Correa in the 2nd round (I think) in 2016, he had a reputation for being an active edge-setter and had a high "motor." When he got to Baltimore, however, the Ravens tried to put him in a new position and, to put it mildly, it hasn't worked out. Now Correa is starting to look for all the world like a high-end bust. Same with Tony Jefferson, for whom they paid a lot of money. To me, he was more of a throwback, a Ronnie Lott type (OK, not that good), an effective in-the-box safety near the line of scrimmage rather than back in the secondary chasing receivers and tight ends. Yet, the Ravens have seldom used him that way and he's understandably struggled at times.

Instead of taking players who fit what they're trying to do, and then putting them in positions and situations where they can best succeed, the Ravens oftentimes take the opposite approach and make the player adapt. That's not usually a good formula and something good teams seldom do.

 

Edited by mdrunning

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Posted (edited)

13 minutes ago, mikemor1 said:

I know his track record with WR's- and when they drafted Perriman I found myself saying- Who???

He tries to get too cute with the draft, IMHO- look at the Correa debacle-they could have had a WR.

Sorry you lost me.....quick snap shot? Who would they have possibly picked instead. At that point in the draft?

Ozzie is always going to lean towards DF. ...that could be part of the problem of no high quality drafts on OF.

Edited by Guido2

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48 minutes ago, mikemor1 said:

look at what the Raven's did at the end of yesterday's game: 44 secs on the clock and they throw a 8 yard pass to Watson in the hopes he can get out of bounds- really????

That was the o line's fault .....

Seriously, this team seems so clueless at times .....

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2 minutes ago, Guido2 said:

Sorry you lost me.....quick snap shot?

Correa hasn't panned out and instead of using a second round draft choice on him, they could have used that pick for a WR.

I remember when they got Correa they dropped down several spots to "snag" him and they were so thrilled with themselves in how they did it. At the time, they couldn't believe he was still available.  I think it's proved obvious why he was still sitting there.

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5 minutes ago, Guido2 said:

Sorry you lost me.....quick snap shot? Who would they have possibly picked instead. At that point in the draft?

Ozzie is always going to lean towards DF. ...that could be part of the problem of no high quality drafts on OF.

 

Just now, mikemor1 said:

Correa hasn't panned out and instead of using a second round draft choice on him, they could have used that pick for a WR.

I remember when they got Correa they dropped down several spots to "snag" him and they were so thrilled with themselves in how they did it. At the time, they couldn't believe he was still available.  I think it's proved obvious why he was still sitting there.

So who do you think they should have selected  as a WR and not picked Correra.

IMO....Ozzie seems to do the Costco thing as far as players. He 'buys' in bulk (especially defense) and 'hopes' to find a gem or two. Yes that strategy may work and it is cheaper...and defensive players are always cheaper. . But as they say...you gotta pay to play. 

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As a Giants vet I want a veteran coach but NO Josh McDaniels. Any guy who would trade FOR Tebow lacks football judgment. 

Jim Schwartz, Todd Haley, John Fox, Tom Coughlin I would be OK with.  IMO if the Giants hire an offense guy Eli is toast. 

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5 minutes ago, Guido2 said:

 

So who do you think they should have selected  as a WR and not picked Correra.

IMO....Ozzie seems to do the Costco thing as far as players. He 'buys' in bulk (especially defense) and 'hopes' to find a gem or two. Yes that strategy may work and it is cheaper...and defensive players are always cheaper. . But as they say...you gotta pay to play. 

I realize you didn't ask me, but I don't think the Correa selection is as much a case of who else could the Ravens have taken, as it is miscasting a guy in a role to which he's clearly not suited. In all drafts, there are always cases of guys who were selected vs. those who should have been. That happens to everyone.

To me, the above signals that the scouts and the coaches are not on the same page. Scouts can only evaluate a guy based on what he's done in college and grade him accordingly. 

As Ken McKuskick on Russell Street Report recently wrote about Correa:

Correa may be the saddest healthy case. He’s poised to finish his 2

nd season as a core ST player who has failed at his first 2 positions, OLB and ILB. Time is running out and it’s not clear where (or if) his next opportunity will arise.

McKusick went on to label Correa among the Ravens' "transitional players," which generally means they have no future with the team. Granted, there's no way of knowing if Correa would have ever been a successful pro regardless, but the Ravens' handling of him isn't providing the opportunities to find out.

 

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6 minutes ago, mdrunning said:

I realize you didn't ask me, but I don't think the Correa selection is as much a case of who else could the Ravens have taken, as it is miscasting a guy in a role to which he's clearly not suited. In all drafts, there are always cases of guys who were selected vs. those who should have been. That happens to everyone.

To me, the above signals that the scouts and the coaches are not on the same page. Scouts can only evaluate a guy based on what he's done in college and grade him accordingly. 

As Ken McKuskick on Russell Street Report recently wrote about Correa:

 

 

McKusick went on to label Correa among the Ravens' "transitional players," which generally means they have no future with the team. Granted, there's no way of knowing if Correa would have ever been a successful pro regardless, but the Ravens' handling of him isn't providing the opportunities to find out.

 

My guess is that the thinking was that the Ravens would run a true 3-4....not a hybrid....at the time. ...which at times seemed like a 4-4.

Frankly sometimes I watched them line up ....and it was more like a defensive scrum than a defense. :lol:

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2 hours ago, mdrunning said:

It's been assumed that Bruce Ariens would step down in Arizona after the season, but so far no word. The Cardinals are an aging team, and Ariens, as one of the oldest coaches in the league, might not want to be part of an overhaul at this point.

Ariens has pulled the pin.

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The Ravens were one of the best scoring teams the second half of the season. The defense lost the game yesterday.

Just saying. 

Seriously though, had this team stayed healthy, they would be in the playoffs.  I don't know how anyone could disagree with that.

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1 minute ago, alienrace said:

The Ravens were one of the best scoring teams the second half of the season. The defense lost the game yesterday.

Inconsistency lost the game. They couldn't find a way to play all four quarters on both sides of the ball, starting with Q1. That's coaching; how can it be anything else?

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Posted (edited)

The Bengals had the 31st-ranked defense against the run, yet the Ravens threw the ball 47 times yesterday. To the tune of a 4.3 yds per attempt, no less, and in frigid conditions with receivers who would have trouble hanging on to passes if it were a warm spring day. 

I know injuries hurt the Ravens this year (particularly Yanda and Jimmy Smith, who would have been suspended had he not gotten hurt), but the fact is they were gift-wrapped a schedule that included numerous back-up quarterbacks, and in the second half of the season, in particular, a lot of non-contenders who were forced to play said backups. After the bye week, when they were 4-5 and the schedule eased, they went up against Brett Hundley, Tom Savage, Jacoby Brissett, and DeShone Kizer. They beat one good quarterback this season (Matthew Stafford) and a halfway decent one (Andy Dalton in Week 1).

In the final month, however, the Ravens spit the bit when they went up against a likely Hall of Famer (Big Ben), and an average Andy Dalton yesterday (at home, no less).

To me, that doesn't sound like a legitimate playoff team, injuries notwithstanding. 

Edited by mdrunning

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47 minutes ago, mdrunning said:

To me, that doesn't sound like a legitimate playoff team, injuries notwithstanding. 

Look at the Titans and Bills, and their scoring differential.  Then look at the Ravens.  Are you telling me that the Titans and Bills were better teams?  (yes, I know the Titans beat the Ravens) Yet they are playoff teams. 

The Ravens took the Steelers, who most agree is one of the top two AFC teams to the brink at their house.  Yes, the Ravens were contenders. 

I know the "blow it up" crowd is very likely to be highly disappointed going forward. 

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Posted (edited)

I don't believe they were a legitimate playoff team. They are too inconsistent and they have a number of tactical and personnel problems. They looked better than they were in the back half or so because they faced a lot of teams that were down for one reason or another. When it mattered, they failed. Playoff teams, when it matters, step up.

We'll get some kind of press release comments from Bisciotti about how this is a winning organization, Harbaugh and Marty will very likely keep their jobs, and next year will be very similar to this year, I believe. It's unlikely they'll draft a real game changer at 16. Sure, guys have been drafted lower and succeeded wildly but it's rare. They'll probably focus on the offense and Ozzie will probably try - and fail - to get a good #1 receiver. They need one, and he can't draft them, but that won't stop him making the attempt.

Edited by Evil Yoda

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4 hours ago, Guido2 said:

 

So who do you think they should have selected  as a WR and not picked Correra.

IMO....Ozzie seems to do the Costco thing as far as players. He 'buys' in bulk (especially defense) and 'hopes' to find a gem or two. Yes that strategy may work and it is cheaper...and defensive players are always cheaper. . But as they say...you gotta pay to play. 

Sterling Shepard or Pharoh Cooper come to mind. Would they have been #1's? Maybe Cooper but they would have been more productive in the WR position and overall contribution to the team than Correa.

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5 hours ago, Eastside Terp said:

I have argued for stability on here for more than a decade, but think about this .....

Everyone admits Harbaugh isn't an x and o guy and is a terrible game manager .....

Supposedly his strength in organizational and leadership.....

But If you are not a sme and want to be a leader you have to surround yourself with good people. ....

All we seem to do every year is get rid of the people Harbaugh surrounds himself with .....

 

Agreed

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Posted (edited)

Bills and Titans are both better teams imo- they won when they had to win. It's why they're in the playoffs and we are not.

 

Edited by poefolks

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4 hours ago, alienrace said:

The Ravens were one of the best scoring teams the second half of the season. The defense lost the game yesterday.

Just saying. 

Seriously though, had this team stayed healthy, they would be in the playoffs.  I don't know how anyone could disagree with that.

Some do. Have you seen the posts?

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2 minutes ago, bmore_ken said:

Some do. Have you seen the posts?

The Ravens have snatched defeat out of the jaws of victory more then once. More then I care to remember to be honest. 

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