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hst2

The reckless irresponsibility of the GOP shows that conservatism is dead - there is only the cult of Trump

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I’m old enough to remember when the Republican Party was pro-FBI, pro-morality and anti-deficits. What a startling turnaround. Now Republicans are issuing venomous and cretinous attacks on the FBI that make a mockery of their reputation as the party of “law and order.” They are unwilling to condemn a president whose lawyer allegedly paid off a porn actress, who endorsed an alleged child molester for the Senate and who tolerated aides who allegedly beat their wives, making a mockery of their reputation as the party of “family values.” And they are going on a spending and tax-cut binge that makes a mockery of their reputation as the party of fiscal discipline.

We are a long way removed from 1953 when President Dwight D. Eisenhower said, “There must be balanced budgets before we are again on a safe and sound system in our economy.” We are even a long way removed from 2013 when Rep. Paul D. Ryan (R-Wis.) warned that debt “will weigh down our country like an anchor,” and from 2016 when Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R.-Ky.) said that “this level of national debt is dangerous and unacceptable.”

In 2009, with the country in the midst of its worst recession in decades (unemployment rate: 8.3 percent ), all but three Republicans in Congress voted against President Barack Obama’s much-needed $787 billion stimulus package. Now, with a healthy economy (unemployment rate: 4.1 percent), a majority of House and Senate Republicans voted for a $560 billion spending package. Republicans are turning economic logic on its head. Periods of economic expansion should be used to balance the budget. Then, when a downturn hits, that’s the time for stimulatory spending increases and tax cuts. Running stratospheric deficits now leaves us defenseless to fight a future recession.

I’m starting to think that MAGA stands for Make America Greece Anon. Trump is leading Republicans to fiscal, intellectual and moral perdition. There is no longer a conservative party in this country. There is only a cult of Trump.

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The 1%'s assault on the Democratic process came to fruition with the passage, and subsequent use of, the Citizen's United decision.  That coupled with a corrupt Supreme Court that saw fit to bestow certain Constitutional rights up 'certain corporations of a particular size', and the coup was complete.

The American financial elite now effectively OWN the US of A, lock, stock and Congress.

The 'resistance', such as it is, by default falls to the DNC, which is a lot like giving your drunk uncle the keys to your new Cadillac.

 

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The GOP really hasn't favored small government or low spending since Reagan, when Cheney discovered no one cared (or, that's what he thought) if he borrowed to spend. History will not be kind to Mr. Cheney.

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58 minutes ago, Evil Yoda said:

The GOP really hasn't favored small government or low spending since Reagan, when Cheney discovered no one cared (or, that's what he thought) if he borrowed to spend. History will not be kind to Mr. Cheney.

They were most certainly against it over the past eight years.

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Just now, hst2 said:

They were most certainly against it over the past eight years.

Sure. Everyone's against the other guy's projects.

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Good to see that the DNC’s Press Office working on Sunday.

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5 minutes ago, MiddleOfTheRoad said:

Good to see that the DNC’s Press Office working on Sunday.

RightEdgeOfTheRoad! Welcome! :)

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There is no one inside the Beltway, government or media, in a position to lecture anyone on acting responsibly.

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2 hours ago, hst2 said:

 

Again!?

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1 hour ago, Evil Yoda said:

Sure. Everyone's against the other guy's projects.

To begin with, they didn't just go against "the other guy" then, they just went against what they themselves have been preaching for the last eight years, if not the last 80 years. They did this because that is what Trump has demanded of them.

The Democratic Congress worked with Bush. The intransigence we saw with the last Congress in dealing with Obama is certainly unique in my life time. And it extended beyond policy and involved stealing a Supreme Court seat and turning around and supporting exactly what they opposed just a couple of years ago. Their opposition extended to meekly responding, if responding at all, to right-wing attacks on Obama's faith and citizenship. This paved the way for Trump.

To make matters worse, they opposed spending when it was needed and support it now, while the economy is robust, which threatens to undermine it. I have seen nothing like thst in my life time.

When you see a party turn to a con man for survival, and it wins them even more power, you have to wonder about its health. When you see the kind of incompetent governing they bring, you have to wonder about the health of the nation.

Edited by hst2

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37 minutes ago, MiddleOfTheRoad said:

There is no one inside the Beltway, government or media, in a position to lecture anyone on acting responsibly.

Deficits came down under Obama. He also worked with Republicans to institute spending caps.

Under Clinton we achieved surpluses and began to pay down the publicly held debt.

What the Republicans have done over the past two months has been the height of fiscal irresponsibility.

This irresponsibility is compounded by the fact that Trump inherited a growing economy and relatively low unemployment. This was a moment when a responsible leader would have urged eradicating the deficit and paying down the debt.

The failure to do this will make the next recession, or crisis, harder to deal with because we will be limited in terms of our ability to use any fiscal remedies to prop up the economy and/or mitigate the downturn.

Edited by JoyinMudville

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Look up double santa to see the actual strategy here.

dont do image search though.

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Just now, JoyinMudville said:

Deficits came down under Obama. He also worked with Republicans to institute spending caps.

Under Clinton we achieved surpluses and began to pay down the publicly held debt.

What the Republicans have done over the past two months has been the height of fiscal irresponsibility.

Deficits may have come down under Obama but the debt doubled.  What the Republicans have done is, at best, uncertain right now.  Even the worse prognosis for the GOP plan reducing the amount of funds taken from citizens in the form of taxes predicts $1.2 - $1.5 T increase in the debt over 10 years. President Bush and Obama averaged that in each year of their terms.  If fiscal responsibility is your measure of governing, Trump is just another in a long line of failure.

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9 minutes ago, MiddleOfTheRoad said:

Deficits may have come down under Obama but the debt doubled.  What the Republicans have done is, at best, uncertain right now.  Even the worse prognosis for the GOP plan reducing the amount of funds taken from citizens in the form of taxes predicts $1.2 - $1.5 T increase in the debt over 10 years. President Bush and Obama averaged that in each year of their terms.  If fiscal responsibility is your measure of governing, Trump is just another in a long line of failure.

You're misreading that. That 1.2 to 1.5 increase in the projections for our growing debt is in addition to the debt that we would have already accrued under existing 2016 policies.

So, we were running annual deficits of $500 to $600 billion annually. Multiply that by 10 and you get $5 to $6 trillion in additional debt. Because of Trump/GOP policies we're now looking at trillion dollar deficits which means $6.2 to $7.5 trillion in additional debt and that's based on some very dubious assumptions such as annual GDP growth of 3%.

Business cycles are cyclical. What happens when we hit an inevitable recession? Deficits and debt will go up further. What happens if we hit another financial crisis, and based on the GOP's orgy of deregulation I'd say that's likely? You're looking at deficits of 2 trillion a year and the potential for default. Banana republic here we come!!!!

Edited by JoyinMudville

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8 minutes ago, MiddleOfTheRoad said:

Deficits may have come down under Obama but the debt doubled.  What the Republicans have done is, at best, uncertain right now.  Even the worse prognosis for the GOP plan reducing the amount of funds taken from citizens in the form of taxes predicts $1.2 - $1.5 T increase in the debt over 10 years. President Bush and Obama averaged that in each year of their terms.  If fiscal responsibility is your measure of governing, Trump is just another in a long line of failure.

Since the Republicans prevented Obama from doing anything. I'm always interested in the claim that he caused the debt to rise so much.

The fact is the debt would have gone up on its own by three trillion because of taxing and spending policies that predated him. And "the Great Recession drove up spending on safety net programs, such as Medicaid and food stamps, without the president or Congress doing a thing'. He is responsible for making the Bush tax cuts permanent, which drove up the debt, but those tax cuts were hardly his idea. And then, he was combating the greatest economic downturn since the Great depression, and going into the debt to deal with that is expected and prudent -especially as interest rates were low. What's the reason for it today?

 

 

 

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Here's what I know. I'm just one man, but my health insurance out paced my pay check, and for the first time in my 62 years, real estate depreciated.  

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Just now, mrdeltoid said:

Here's what I know. I'm just one man, but my health insurance out paced my pay check, and for the first time in my 62 years, real estate depreciated.  

Bubbles burst.

The rate of health inflation decreased in the years after the ACA was enacted.

People act as if health care costs weren't skyrocketing before Obama.

As for real estate. Real estate depreciated in several regions throughout the United States throughout the 70s and 80s

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28 minutes ago, hst2 said:

Since the Republicans prevented Obama from doing anything. I'm always interested in the claim that he caused the debt to rise so much.

The fact is the debt would have gone up on its own by three trillion because of taxing and spending policies that predated him. And "the Great Recession drove up spending on safety net programs, such as Medicaid and food stamps, without the president or Congress doing a thing'. He is responsible for making the Bush tax cuts permanent, which drove up the debt, but those tax cuts were hardly his idea. And then, he was combating the greatest economic downturn since the Great depression, and going into the debt to deal with that is expected and prudent -especially as interest rates were low. What's the reason for it today?

 

 

 

That’s right, I forgot.  When it’s a Democrat as President, it’s the other guy’s fault.  Do Democrats EVER take responsibility for anything? You guys might as well be Republicans since your acceptance of accountability is the same.

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9 minutes ago, MiddleOfTheRoad said:

That’s right, I forgot.  When it’s a Democrat as President, it’s the other guy’s fault.  Do Democrats EVER take responsibility for anything? You guys might as well be Republicans since your acceptance of accountability is the same.

I'm pretty sure democrats don't campaign on fiscal responsibility. Republicans however.......

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The U.S. government spends more money than it brings in through revenue, a gap known as the budget deficit. The government ran a deficit of $666 billion in 2017. The deficit in 2019 is expected to eclipse $1.1 trillion, in part because of measures put into place since Trump took office.

In June, the Congressional Budget Office projected the U.S. government would run deficits of roughly $10 trillion over the next decade. Since that report, Congress passed a tax cut law that is projected to add at least $1 trillion to the debt over 10 years, and last week Congress agreed on roughly $500 billion in new spending measures over the next two years.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/business/wp/2018/02/11/in-big-reversal-new-trump-budget-will-give-up-on-longtime-republican-goal-of-eliminating-deficit/?hpid=hp_no-name_no-name%3Apage%2Fbreaking-news-bar&utm_term=.1344f344f633

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3 hours ago, bmore_ken said:

I'm pretty sure democrats don't campaign on fiscal responsibility. Republicans however.......

That's the thing that is annoying. We all know about "tax and spend" Democrats. Republicans are supposed to be good at fiscal policy. But like ivan has pointed out, mainline Republicans are now "tax and spend" Republicans who also destroy revenue.

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9 hours ago, MiddleOfTheRoad said:

That’s right, I forgot.  When it’s a Democrat as President, it’s the other guy’s fault.  Do Democrats EVER take responsibility for anything? You guys might as well be Republicans since your acceptance of accountability is the same.

Well, I cited a source, two, actually, one is a conservative, the other, based on a study by a bi-partisan group. But you choose to ignore it and whine.

I get it, the party you support is a disaster and in its members have become puppets for an errart, reckless demagogue.  I suppose you'd like the Democrats to take responsibility for THAT.

Edited by hst2

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54 minutes ago, hst2 said:

Well, I cited a source, two, actually, one is a conservative, the other, based on a study by a bi-partisan group. But you choose to ignore it and whine.

I get it, the party you support is a disaster and in its members have become puppets for an errart, reckless demagogue.  I suppose you'd like the Democrats to take responsibility for THAT.

The only thing the Democrats need to take responsibility for regarding the election of Trump is that they rigged their primary to put forth an incompetent, untrustworthy unlikeable candidate who had the distinct embarrassment of losing to Trump.

Let me correct something; I don’t support the Republican Party.  I support some of their ideas, and certainly more of the their ideas than the nonsense that comes out Pelosi and Schumer, but to suggest that I support the Republican Party is just another of your frequent errors.  Bush’s spending was as foolish as was his starting a war in Iraq.  How one can start a war and reduce taxes at the same time is beyond ny understanding.  Obama’s spending was, if not criminally stupid, at least as foolish as was Bush’s.  Obama continued a war we didn’t need and borrowed roughly the same value as Bush.  Putting forth Obama as a hero of responsible fiduciary actions is a little like putting forth the Titanic as a picture of seaworthiness.

 

 

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Nothing was rigged. Bernie may have gotten the votes if he would have shut up with his ‘I’m a socialist “ shtick. 

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12 hours ago, hst2 said:

Since the Republicans prevented Obama from doing anything.

 

 

lol.  classic!

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