zenwalk

US Healthcare Ranked Worst in Developed World

172 posts in this topic

13 hours ago, WKDWZD said:

I have repeatedly told you that the NHS is not the state. You are spreading lies through your ignorance and dishonesty.

This thread topic is about the failed state of the US healthcare system stop trying to deflect from that embarrasment by trying to make it about someone and something that you are clearly totally ignorant about.

I don’t give a rat’s rumpus, how many times you “ have repeatedly told me” that that the NHS is not the state. How many posts into this thread now, and yet you refuse to give a plausible explanation, as to how the UK’s ...”NATIONAL” ... Health Service operates independently from the UK. Quite simply, you can’t. That’s why you’ve reduced yourself from any rational explanation,  to accusations of spreading lies, and all the other screeching garbage. Post a link that corroborates the independence of the NHS, from the state, (the UK), or give it a rest. 

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57 minutes ago, EGoldstein said:

Still waiting on your answer to the question of what miracle cure was available to Alfie at no cost to his parents or the state.  Certainly you have an answer since you have stated this as fact numerous times.  

It was never about a miracle cure. How many times does does it have to be stated, that the issue wasn’t the fact that Alfie was condemned to die by the state. The issue was the fact that his parents were totally removed from the NHS ruling, and subsequent adjudication. Italy offered an alternative that included flight, at no cost to either the state, or his parents. If you’re a parent, please tell me the choice you would have made. 

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7 minutes ago, volperdinger said:

It was never about a miracle cure. How many times does does it have to be stated, that the issue wasn’t the fact that Alfie was condemned to die by the state. The issue was the fact that his parents were totally removed from the NHS ruling, and subsequent adjudication. Italy offered an alternative that included flight, at no cost to either the state, or his parents. If you’re a parent, please tell me the choice you would have made. 

I would have thought of the pain my child was suffering and let him go instead of selfishly trying to keep him alive when he would never get better.

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8 minutes ago, mrsmlh said:

I would have thought of the pain my child was suffering and let him go instead of selfishly trying to keep him alive when he would never get better.

For the umpteenth time, can you explain to me, how an offer from Italy, that promised an alternative treatment program, at no expense to either the parents or the UK, would be an option you wouldn’t consider? After hearing of this option, why in the world would you ascribe to the idea that one is being selfish to not pursue any and all avenues? 

 

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13 minutes ago, volperdinger said:

For the umpteenth time, can you explain to me, how an offer from Italy, that promised an alternative treatment program, at no expense to either the parents or the UK, would be an option you wouldn’t consider? After hearing of this option, why in the world would you ascribe to the idea that one is being selfish to not pursue any and all avenues? 

 

What was the alternative treatment program?  My understanding is that it was hospice care.

Now I'm done with this conversation with you.  You are determined to make this thread about the UK having horrible health care because you refuse to admit that the US's healthcare isn't the best in the world.

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16 minutes ago, mrsmlh said:

What was the alternative treatment program?  My understanding is that it was hospice care.

Now I'm done with this conversation with you.  You are determined to make this thread about the UK having horrible health care because you refuse to admit that the US's healthcare isn't the best in the world.

The alternative treatment program was any program that was offered as an option to a a determined death sentence, at the hands of the state, that totally removes any decision making process from the parents. How this continues to be lost on you is mind boggling. Thank you for ending this conversation. I’m really disgusted at this point anyway. 

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On 4/30/2018 at 7:03 PM, volperdinger said:

You’ll argue no more? You haven’t argued at all. You’ve offered nothing other than name calling, and the defense of the NHS in this case without ever providing a rational reason as to why the NHS, whose role in this case has obviously ended to pursue other means? . Why would you possibly object to the child’s parents’ attempt to to pursue another avenue at saving the life of their child, at no cost to the state?

Sorry but YOU are the one who made the claim that the NHS = "The State".  So it's your job to provide definitive proof that your assertion is true, not someone else's job to prove that it's not

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On 5/1/2018 at 1:37 PM, WKDWZD said:

That, I'm afraid, I do not believe. The Only reason a person would not be operated on is if the chance of survival of the anethesia was less than the benefit and success of the operation. The fact that cataract surgery is a simple operation, performed under a local anesthetic would not disbar someone from cataract surgery due to old age.

I expected to hear from you saying you did not believe me and to defend your health care system.

Have a nice day

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19 minutes ago, Rocketwolf said:

I expected to hear from you saying you did not believe me and to defend your health care system.

Have a nice day

Well you weren't dissapointed then were you.

The NHS has many flaws and problems in it that you could fairly have highlighted, but people going blind through delays to, and being denied access to cataract surgery due to old age is not one of them.

Have a nice day yourself.

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4 minutes ago, WKDWZD said:

Well you weren't dissapointed then were you.

The NHS has many flaws and problems in it that you could fairly have highlighted, but people going blind through delays to, and being denied access to cataract surgery due to old age is not one of them.

Have a nice day yourself.

lol  :) Okay. So . . . never in the many years of our back and forth have you agreed with criticism of your healthcare system! I get that -- we all think what we know is the best and we defend it.  When we had a discussion about the NHS ruling on mammograms you wouldn't even acknowledge that, perhaps, every three years between mammograms is a bad idea.  

And, up until last year, NHS was rationing cataract surgeries. Until last year when they were told to stop.  15 months of growing cataracts will probably blind the person and that's just not right. 

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54 minutes ago, banner1124 said:

Sorry but YOU are the one who made the claim that the NHS = "The State".  So it's your job to provide definitive proof that your assertion is true, not someone else's job to prove that it's not

It is "The State".  All you have to do is see who oversees it. 

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1 hour ago, Ode2Joy said:

It is "The State".  All you have to do is see who oversees it. 

Sorry but you telling me is not proof

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I like browsing the Daily Mail every day just for the sheer number of varied articles from Real news to the Trash. They have stories every day just about on their crummy healthcare system in the UK. Makes the US sound like it's Great here in comparison.

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Posted (edited)

21 hours ago, Bartman said:

I like browsing the Daily Mail every day just for the sheer number of varied articles from Real news to the Trash. They have stories every day just about on their crummy healthcare system in the UK. Makes the US sound like it's Great here in comparison.

Your assessment of The Daily Mail (Online) is spot on. It relishes in publishing sensational stories and exaggerating half truths and rumours. The paper edition available over here does not run most of the stuff that you read over there but as a source of news it is still more usefull to cut up and use as arse wipes in your loo. The online editions of The Guardian and The Telegraph are little better, unfortunately once something has been printed by those rags, other usually more respectable news sources might quote them. I imagine that you have your equivalent dishonest 'news sources' over there. For a more honest  view of British News, you'd be better to source The BBC, Reuters or one of the more respected news sources. ;)

Edited by WKDWZD

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16 hours ago, mrsmlh said:

I would have thought of the pain my child was suffering and let him go instead of selfishly trying to keep him alive when he would never get better.

 

15 hours ago, volperdinger said:

For the umpteenth time, can you explain to me, how an offer from Italy, that promised an alternative treatment program, at no expense to either the parents or the UK, would be an option you wouldn’t consider? After hearing of this option, why in the world would you ascribe to the idea that one is being selfish to not pursue any and all avenues? 

 

Oh come on dude, seriously, the lady had already answered your question. Why do do keep asking the same thing, are you having a failure to comprehend your reading problem?

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6 hours ago, WKDWZD said:

 

Oh come on dude, seriously, the lady had already answered your question. Why do do keep asking the same thing, are you having a failure to comprehend your reading problem?

How many posts now, have your rebuttals been reduced to name calling and insults? It’s quite easy, answer the basic question you and your fellow defenders of the NHS/ British Courts  refuse to answer. When you stop dodging the question, I’ll let it go. 

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7 hours ago, Bartman said:

I like browsing the Daily Mail every day just for the sheer number of varied articles from Real news to the Trash. They have stories every day just about on their crummy healthcare system in the UK. Makes the US sound like it's Great here in comparison.

Might I suggest that you are only seeing what you want to see

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6 hours ago, WKDWZD said:

Your assessment of The Daily Mail (Online) is spot on. I relishes in publishing sensational stories and exaggerating half truths and rumours. The paper edition available over here does not run most of the stuff that you read over there but as a source of news it is still more usefull to cut up and use as arse wipes in your loo. The online editions of The Guardian and The Telegraph are little better, unfortunately once something has been printed by those rags, other usually more respectable news sources might quote them. I imagine that you have your equivalent dishonest 'news sources' over there. For a more honest  view of British News, you'd be better to source The BBC, Reuters or one of the more respected news sources. ;)

you'll have to forgive some of my fellow countrymen, they can't tell the difference between a real newspaper and tabloid filth....this symptom caused by being fixated by Faux news....

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23 hours ago, volperdinger said:

It was never about a miracle cure. How many times does does it have to be stated, that the issue wasn’t the fact that Alfie was condemned to die by the state. The issue was the fact that his parents were totally removed from the NHS ruling, and subsequent adjudication. Italy offered an alternative that included flight, at no cost to either the state, or his parents. If you’re a parent, please tell me the choice you would have made. 

The fact is that Alfie had an incurable condition.  Alfie was condemned to die not by the state but by genetics, however that FACT seems beyond your grasp.  Italy offered nothing more than continued suffering, at of course no cost to the parents or state.  If you want to blame someone for Alfie's condition, blame God or blame genetics.  Your blame will of course be at no cost to the parents or the state.  

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45 minutes ago, volperdinger said:

How many posts now, have your rebuttals been reduced to name calling and insults? It’s quite easy, answer the basic question you and your fellow defenders of the NHS/ British Courts  refuse to answer. When you stop dodging the question, I’ll let it go. 

I've answered you, the fact that you don't like my answer is irrelevant.

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Posted (edited)

31 minutes ago, mrsmlh said:

I've answered you, the fact that you don't like my answer is irrelevant.

Sorry, but you’ve answered nothing. All you’ve done, is keep repeating the same old crap that nothing else could be done, that there was no alternative, when there was an obvious alternative that the state refused. I’m sorry for your loss, but your belligerence to acknowledge this is simply astounding. 

Edited by volperdinger

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51 minutes ago, volperdinger said:

Sorry, but you’ve answered nothing. All you’ve done, is keep repeating the same old crap that nothing else could be done, that there was no alternative, when there was an obvious alternative that the state refused. I’m sorry for your loss, but your belligerence to acknowledge this is simply astounding. 

You asked if I would have taken my child to Italy my answer was: 

I would have thought of the pain my child was suffering and let him go instead of selfishly trying to keep him alive when he would never get better.

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55 minutes ago, volperdinger said:

Sorry, but you’ve answered nothing. All you’ve done, is keep repeating the same old crap that nothing else could be done, that there was no alternative, when there was an obvious alternative that the state refused. I’m sorry for your loss, but your belligerence to acknowledge this is simply astounding. 

The obvious alternative was to prolong the suffering of a child.  You have made your position quite clear on the issue of children suffering, what would you like to expound on next, your approval of outright torture?    

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5 minutes ago, EGoldstein said:

The obvious alternative was to prolong the suffering of a child.  You have made your position quite clear on the issue of children suffering, what would you like to expound on next, your approval of outright torture?    

Argument lost post.

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