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KeepItReal

Lamar Jackson Wonderlic Score = 13

79 posts in this topic

6 minutes ago, Pickle20 said:

I don't remember the defense saying that stuff, especially once 2008 got underway and Flacco played well. In fact I remember Suggs vocally supporting Flacco.

And dude, if you remember what posters here said in 2008, you seriously need to get a life.

Jog your memory https://russellstreetreport.com/2008/10/23/street-talk/ravens-suggs-troy-should-be-the-starter/

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56 minutes ago, Pickle20 said:

OK, got it. That was at the low point of Flacco's season. Can't blame him for saying what he said.

I can. He is not a GM. Meanwhile he was crying for Kaepernick last year.

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2 minutes ago, Manny said:

I can. He is not a GM. Meanwhile he was crying for Kaepernick last year.

He was asked a question. So what about what he thinks?
Sounds like you really have an issue with black folks supporting for, or supporting, black athletes.

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1 hour ago, Pickle20 said:

He was asked a question. So what about what he thinks?
Sounds like you really have an issue with black folks supporting for, or supporting, black athletes.

I would like him to produce one post by me calling for signing Kaepernick.  Dude has a boner for me. I’m flattered and creeped out at the same time  :lol:

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4 hours ago, bmore_ken said:

I would like him to produce one post by me calling for signing Kaepernick.  Dude has a boner for me. I’m flattered and creeped out at the same time  :lol:

No one claimed you wanted Kapernick. I was talking about Suggs.

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5 hours ago, Pickle20 said:

He was asked a question. So what about what he thinks?
Sounds like you really have an issue with black folks supporting for, or supporting, black athletes.

Not at all, but Suggs’ comments were inappropriate. And though he is probably a good teammate in general, comments like that compromise the comradery in the locker room.

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10 hours ago, Manny said:

Not at all, but Suggs’ comments were inappropriate. And though he is probably a good teammate in general, comments like that compromise the comradery in the locker room.

Got a link? The ravens were 11-5 and went to the AFCCG that year. I’ll take the “compromise” if that’s the result.

 

 

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1 hour ago, Pickle20 said:

Got a link? The ravens were 11-5 and went to the AFCCG that year. I’ll take the “compromise” if that’s the result.

 

 

You are not a good teammate if you are fostering division in the locker room. Just because you agreed with Suggs then and now does not make it appropriate for him to be doing. 

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2 minutes ago, Manny said:

You are not a good teammate if you are fostering division in the locker room. Just because you agreed with Suggs then and now does not make it appropriate for him to be doing. 

I didn't agree with Suggs then. But Suggs has a big mouth. Suggs is Suggs. Just go out there and perform like an All-Pro, which he did in 2008, and the rest will take care of itself.

Besides, it was 10 years ago. Time to let it go.

 

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1 hour ago, Pickle20 said:

I didn't agree with Suggs then. But Suggs has a big mouth. Suggs is Suggs. Just go out there and perform like an All-Pro, which he did in 2008, and the rest will take care of itself.

Besides, it was 10 years ago. Time to let it go.

 

Good luck with that :lol:

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Keep It Real is spot on when he asserted that (generally) you can't be stupid and be a successful NFL quarterback.  Sure, there are a few anomalies like Dan Marino, Jim Kelley, and Terry Bradshaw, but those players are the exception not the norm.  Quarterbacks are field generals who have to make quick and good decisions.  I'm not convinced that Lamar Jackson has the mental ability to get the job done in the NFL as a quarterback.  Yes, he ran a pro style offense at Louisville.  But he will never see defenses in the NFL like the ones he saw in college.  Ryan Fitzpatrick the Harvard quarterback who has bounced around the NFL with various clubs, and had a perfect Wonderlic score, keeps resurfacing in the league not because of his cannon like arm or elusiveness from the rush.  He keeps getting jobs because he's smart.  NFL personnel guru Bill Polian was right about Jackson.   He said that he needs to be converted to another position that can best utilize his skill set.  The sooner the Ravens come to that realization the less pain both the team and its fans will endure. 

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Posted (edited)

Averaging well over 200 rushing attempts per year in college (in 12-13 games a year), I have a hard time calling that a true "pro style" offense.  Even Michael Vick at his zenith, in what wasn't a prototypical pro / NFL offense, didn't come close to running the ball that frequently.  Hell, even in college Vick never averaged more than 10-11 carries per game.  It does suggest Jackson is one hell of a talented athlete though.

I thought Flacco looked like a disaster waiting to happen when he played his first few NFL pre-season games, but he improved quickly and put together a pretty good career.  I hope Jackson proves me wrong when his time comes, because I'm a fan of the Ravens more than individual players.  But until he shows it in the NFL, and shows he has the durability to last for a while, I can't help but have my doubts.

Edited by Ravens2006

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1 hour ago, Laker Boy said:

Keep It Real is spot on when he asserted that (generally) you can't be stupid and be a successful NFL quarterback.  Sure, there are a few anomalies like Dan Marino, Jim Kelley, and Terry Bradshaw, but those players are the exception not the norm.  Quarterbacks are field generals who have to make quick and good decisions.  I'm not convinced that Lamar Jackson has the mental ability to get the job done in the NFL as a quarterback.  Yes, he ran a pro style offense at Louisville.  But he will never see defenses in the NFL like the ones he saw in college.  Ryan Fitzpatrick the Harvard quarterback who has bounced around the NFL with various clubs, and had a perfect Wonderlic score, keeps resurfacing in the league not because of his cannon like arm or elusiveness from the rush.  He keeps getting jobs because he's smart.  NFL personnel guru Bill Polian was right about Jackson.   He said that he needs to be converted to another position that can best utilize his skill set.  The sooner the Ravens come to that realization the less pain both the team and its fans will endure. 

Explain Blaine Gabbert and his 42 wonderlic score compared to his NFL career.

Do I wish Lamar Jackson scored better? Sure. But I still think he's gonna be OK.

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17 minutes ago, Pickle20 said:

Explain Blaine Gabbert and his 42 wonderlic score compared to his NFL career.

Do I wish Lamar Jackson scored better? Sure. But I still think he's gonna be OK.

Following your reasoning, steven hawking would have won a couple super bowls....

Seriously, takes a total package .....

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If you go on the Wonderlic site that lists test scores for quarterbacks you will see that generally the better quarterbacks in the league grade out higher on the Wonderlic test.  If Jackson was a wideout or a running back the score wouldn't matter as much.  However, he's the field general, the quarterback.  You can send in plays for him all day long, if he is cognitively unable to read a disguised defense the Ravens will be in trouble.  Certainly there are the outliers who don't score well on the test but perform well on the field, but my guess is that Jackson will not fall into that category.  If the Ravens keep him at quarterback my guess is that he'll be another Troy Smith (also a Hesiman winner with a 15 Wonderlic score). 

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I think Jackson has the ability to succeed as a Quarterback. Unfortunately I have no confidence in the offensive coaching staff on this team. 

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2 hours ago, Laker Boy said:

If you go on the Wonderlic site that lists test scores for quarterbacks you will see that generally the better quarterbacks in the league grade out higher on the Wonderlic test.  If Jackson was a wideout or a running back the score wouldn't matter as much.  However, he's the field general, the quarterback.  You can send in plays for him all day long, if he is cognitively unable to read a disguised defense the Ravens will be in trouble.  Certainly there are the outliers who don't score well on the test but perform well on the field, but my guess is that Jackson will not fall into that category.  If the Ravens keep him at quarterback my guess is that he'll be another Troy Smith (also a Hesiman winner with a 15 Wonderlic score). 

he has a lot more physical tools than troy smith ......

athletes like him can be successful in the nfl until they get hurt .....

 

 

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33 minutes ago, Manny said:

I think Jackson has the ability to succeed as a Quarterback. Unfortunately I have no confidence in the offensive coaching staff on this team. 

I think many of the personnel may be gone during Jackson's prime as a QB, but Morninwheg had success with Vick in Atlanta and Roman has been solid with the run game, both things that could be positives for Jackson.

 

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On 5/9/2018 at 1:24 PM, Laker Boy said:

Keep It Real is spot on when he asserted that (generally) you can't be stupid and be a successful NFL quarterback.  Sure, there are a few anomalies like Dan Marino, Jim Kelley, and Terry Bradshaw, but those players are the exception not the norm.  Quarterbacks are field generals who have to make quick and good decisions.  I'm not convinced that Lamar Jackson has the mental ability to get the job done in the NFL as a quarterback.  Yes, he ran a pro style offense at Louisville.  But he will never see defenses in the NFL like the ones he saw in college.  Ryan Fitzpatrick the Harvard quarterback who has bounced around the NFL with various clubs, and had a perfect Wonderlic score, keeps resurfacing in the league not because of his cannon like arm or elusiveness from the rush.  He keeps getting jobs because he's smart.  NFL personnel guru Bill Polian was right about Jackson.   He said that he needs to be converted to another position that can best utilize his skill set.  The sooner the Ravens come to that realization the less pain both the team and its fans will endure. 

 

LOL. So you want to throw out his college tape and convert the statistically best QB in college the last few years to some other position before giving him a shot at playing QB based on a wonderlic score and what Bill Polian says??

I once thought like you until I started watching Lamar Jacksons tape after we drafted him. I can honestly say I'm not sure why Bill Polian said what he said except that maybe his thinking is that if Lamar Jackson fails as a QB, unlike Darnold, or Rosen, or Allen, etc. Jacksons athletic talent could land him a job at another position (IE WR)

Having looked at his tape though- you'd have to be utterly faithless to disregard the potential he's shown as a passer. You have to watch his tape. Louisiville was a **** team where his pocket is constantly exploding and his WRs dropped more passes than the Ravens did if you can believe it. He was the single most important player to his team than any other college player. Lot of generalities (IE-QB's can't be stupid) get thrown in the trash - especially in sports. We see it all the time. I'm sure the ravens believe his talent / instinct is strong enough to overcome his mental limitations to judge how many gallons of paint he needs in order to paint a 225 sq foot wall in an imagined house. I'm inclined to go with it and give the guy a shot before condemning him to returning punts before he steps into the huddle and show what he can do.

 

 

 

 

 

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Bill Polian is one of the worst GM's in the history of the NFL.

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4 minutes ago, Pickle20 said:

Bill Polian is one of the worst GM's in the history of the NFL.

Also understanding Polian is now making a living based on his hot takes. He's not a journalist even- he's a hot take artist that thrives on getting quotes in the papers/media. Once you start looking at Jackson's tape you see why Belichick and Sean Payton studied him so hard. I think they were thinking very hard on pulling the trigger on the guy at some point. You have very limited time as a HC to examine players coming out- the amount of time they spent with Jackson says a lot to me- and hopefully he shows why on the field when his opportunity comes. At the very least- his opportunity should come- they shouldn't just take it away because of some test that may or may not have any correlation to NFL success as a QB.

 

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13 minutes ago, poefolks said:

Also understanding Polian is now making a living based on his hot takes. He's not a journalist even- he's a hot take artist that thrives on getting quotes in the papers/media. Once you start looking at Jackson's tape you see why Belichick and Sean Payton studied him so hard. I think they were thinking very hard on pulling the trigger on the guy at some point. You have very limited time as a HC to examine players coming out- the amount of time they spent with Jackson says a lot to me- and hopefully he shows why on the field when his opportunity comes. At the very least- his opportunity should come- they shouldn't just take it away because of some test that may or may not have any correlation to NFL success as a QB.

 

Yup. If the Patriots take Jackson he's all the sudden the best QB to ever have been drafted.

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5 hours ago, Pickle20 said:

Bill Polian is one of the worst GM's in the history of the NFL.

I would disagree with that.  As a GM he oversaw the rise to prominence of the Buffalo Bills, the only team to go to 4 straight super bowls.  Even though they lost them all, take a look at the players they had......Jim Kelly, Bruce Smith, Andre Reed, Thurman Thomas, James Loften, Daryl Talley, Corneilious Bennett, Kent Hull.  Some he drafted, some he acquired.  Either way that's an impressive team.  He also took over the expansion Carolina Panthers and had them in the NFC Championship game in their second season.  And of course, he was the architect of the Indianapolis Colts during their most successful period under an Irsay.   He is in the HOF.  You might not like his comments about Jackson, but his record says he is definitely one of the bettor GM's in the history of the NFL.  I bet there are a lot of teams that would trade their GM's and records from that time period for him and his.  There will be time to see if his assessment of Lamar Jackson is right, or way off base.   

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12 hours ago, cprenegade said:

I would disagree with that.  As a GM he oversaw the rise to prominence of the Buffalo Bills, the only team to go to 4 straight super bowls.  Even though they lost them all, take a look at the players they had......Jim Kelly, Bruce Smith, Andre Reed, Thurman Thomas, James Loften, Daryl Talley, Corneilious Bennett, Kent Hull.  Some he drafted, some he acquired.  Either way that's an impressive team.  He also took over the expansion Carolina Panthers and had them in the NFC Championship game in their second season.  And of course, he was the architect of the Indianapolis Colts during their most successful period under an Irsay.   He is in the HOF.  You might not like his comments about Jackson, but his record says he is definitely one of the bettor GM's in the history of the NFL.  I bet there are a lot of teams that would trade their GM's and records from that time period for him and his.  There will be time to see if his assessment of Lamar Jackson is right, or way off base.   

Good points, but I stand by it. He got lucky with Manning falling into his lap. The Colts should have won 5 titles, but he failed to give them a defense that was even average. He consistently whiffed on players in the draft. The Colts are where they are now because of his failings as a GM. And based on that, I put little stock into what he says about Jackson. Especially when Rotoworld agrees:

Quote

We're inclined to believe Polian's rejection of the Bills' offer might have been a blessing in disguise. The game seemed to have passed Polian by during his final years with the Colts. And we wouldn't describe his musings at ESPN as overwhelmingly impressive.

http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nfl/10296/bill-polian

 

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